Re: Kurt Hummel Snark & Bark Thread--Part 8

[arina]

I don't like when celebrities are doing smoking cool for example by doing those photoshoots either but also think it's unfair from media or people overall doing big tragedy from catching celebrity smoking in their private life like they did for example with Naya the one time she has been seen smoking... they are adults, they have often started long time before they became famous, even if they are celebrities they are still also normal people and they cannot worried 24/7 about their image, most of my classmates smoke and nobody judge them for it so it's kinda unfair if the world treat famous people of the same age that much harsher. And I think Glee kids really try to be discreet because I think there are very few pictures of them smoking which is very little considering Glee is starting its 5 season. I personally don't think Chris is a smoker but even if he was I don't think we would ever knew...

That said I am happy when people I like don't smoke, mostly for their health and with singers also for their voice.

I must say I am very suprised to hear about Lea's smoking, I never heard that, I know she said in the past she doesn't and I also would gues her as one of the least probable smokers of the cast because of her growing up on Broadway, being professional singer since she was a child... Maybe she is just a social smoker? It would be really sad to ruin her beautiful voice.

I remember when I was 15, I went to take picture with my favorite czech musical singer (who also studied opera) and was shocked to see him smoking back then. It was 10 years ago... He is still good but I would say his voice sadly is not that "clear" it used to be.... Well, it could be also caused by aging but I think smoking also paid its price...

[ColdFlame96]

I'm not actually surprised if Lea does smoke. It would certainly explain why her breath control has gotten so awful these past couple years. Seriously, as much as I loved her version of Torn, she was gasping for breath after every measure, and considering its a relatively easy song, that's a bit concerning.

[kac]

The breath control is something to be concerned about big time, but just for aesthetic purposes you'd think young women who are concerned about their bodies and appearance would not smoke.

I worked as a massage therapist and there is a foul smell that comes off of regular smokers' skin (not a smokey smell, much worse, it is an unclean awful odour). Not to mention the wrinkles. Not good for someone whose job does depend on their looks.

[fantastica]

there are more than hundreds of chemicals in cigarette smoke. when you inhale them they can affect the body in many ways, most of which we don't even know. we only know about nicotine that causes addiction and tar that can cause cancer, but hardly anything else that contributes to the flavor as well as their health impact. i won't be surprised if regular smokers emit some unusual body odor. not everybody can smell subtle smells. some people have better olfactory glands than others (for example, i can smell gas way before my hubby can smell it). of course we are nothing compared to our beloved cats and dogs. too bad they won't tell us what we smell like.  

when you guys talk about Lea's breathing problem, are you talking about the fact that you can clearly hear her taking a breath while singing? i didn't notice anybody else having this issue, but Lea always seem to need taking hard breaths between lines. I'd like to hear more technical analysis from Marie. I know she mentioned way back that Lea had some bad habit but she didn't explain, because she was in GF's general thread.

I am not a singer and didn't know anything about singing, and my singing knowledge pretty much all comes from Marie. I find them fascinating and want to learn more. I hope Marie will share her knowledge with us. the purpose of critiquing a singer is not to judge him/her, but to help us better appreciate singing and music in general.

when you don't know anything about singing techniques, and don't know how to listen to it, all you care is if the song has a catchy tune and if the singer's voice is pleasant. that's not enough for me. i want to know if the singer is good technically as well as effective in terms of communicating emotionally. i can feel the emotional part, but need a bit guidance when it comes to technicality. it helps me listen to songs from different angles.

anybody else w/ deep music knowledge is also encouraged to share. like I said I am a newbie when it comes to singing. I don't want to be singer. i just want to enjoy other people's singing better.

[ColdFlame96]

I think Marie was referring to the fact that Lea always scoops when she goes up to higher notes. As for her breath control, it didnt used to be that bad, but lately, especially this season, she takes huge gasps of breath every 4 measures even on relatively simple songs like Torn. If she does smoke, that's probably a contributing factor, but I think another factor is that she doesn't know how to belt properly and she's tearing up her vocal chords. If she's not careful, she'll end up with the same fate as Julie Andrews and no one wants that. She also has the same problem that Darren does where she's required to sing songs out of her range, so her voice is becoming strained.

[fantastica]

pardon my ignorance but what does "scoop" mean?

[Jellyrolls]

The breath control is something to be concerned about big time, but just for aesthetic purposes you'd think young women who are concerned about their bodies and appearance would not smoke.

I worked as a massage therapist and there is a foul smell that comes off of regular smokers' skin (not a smokey smell, much worse, it is an unclean awful odour). Not to mention the wrinkles. Not good for someone whose job does depend on their looks.

I don't know if it's still true, but at one point a lot of models and dancers and the like smoked because it helped them keep their weight down (or at least that's what they believed). My guess is if they were smoking, they weren't eating.

[Glorfindel]

^Yes, that's true. One of the conservatories I studied at also had a ballet academy, and many of the dancers smoked to lose weight.  

when you guys talk about Lea's breathing problem, are you talking about the fact that you can clearly hear her taking a breath while singing? i didn't notice anybody else having this issue, but Lea always seem to need taking hard breaths between lines. I'd like to hear more technical analysis from Marie. I know she mentioned way back that Lea had some bad habit but she didn't explain, because she was in GF's general thread.

Lea's bad habit I mentioned before (on GF) is her 'scooping'. It's when she start a note lower than it's supposed to be and sort of slides upwards to the right note. She does it a lot at the beginning and/or the ending of sentences. I find it highly irritating, as it is sloppy and a bit too theatrical/overdone.
But I'm also very irritated by her very audible breathing/inhaling, which is something a trained singer knows they should not do (and are definitely trained not to do). It also reeks of being too theatrical, as in "Look at how hard and deep I have to inhale to get the difficult notes out!".

And yes, I've noticed her shortage of breath/lack of stamina in her breathing and her more raspy voice lately too. Some of that could be caused by smoking (if she indeed smokes regularly), but it could also simply be because recording for Glee is totally different than being in a Broadway musical 8 shows a week.
The Glee actors have to work not only on their singing, but also on their acting, dancing, promoting, looks, etc. Only a small part of their time is dedicated to the singing, and it's usually a rush job with very little time to rehearse. It could be that Lea simply is getting (unintentional) sloppy and/or falls into her Rachel OTT dramatical persona too easily while recording these days.
Lea has an absolute amazing, strong voice, but I have a feeling she is on a slippery slope and slowly getting worse with (not) controlling her little theatrical habits. She really needs to be careful with that, because both the 'scooping' and bad breathing habits are hard to turn off again after indulging them a long time.

I think Marie was referring to the fact that Lea always scoops when she goes up to higher notes. As for her breath control, it didnt used to be that bad, but lately, especially this season, she takes huge gasps of breath every 4 measures even on relatively simple songs like Torn. If she does smoke, that's probably a contributing factor, but I think another factor is that she doesn't know how to belt properly and she's tearing up her vocal chords. If she's not careful, she'll end up with the same fate as Julie Andrews and no one wants that. She also has the same problem that Darren does where she's required to sing songs out of her range, so her voice is becoming strained.

Exactly.

[fantastica]

thanks ladies for the good education. would you mind to give a specific example (from a particular song, a particular line) of "scoop"? since this is hte first time i heard the term, i have no idea what it sounds like. i am very curious.

[ColdFlame96]

thanks ladies for the good education. would you mind to give a specific example (from a particular song, a particular line) of "scoop"? since this is hte first time i heard the term, i have no idea what it sounds like. i am very curious.

If you listen to her version of 'Bring Him Home', you'll hear her do these little yelp things on all the big notes. (Sorry couldn't think of a better word.) that's scooping though.

[MoviesAreLife]

Hasn't Lea always done that? The scooping and the gasping, I mean? Ever since S1 and even before Glee (like in SA)? It's like her trademark. But maybe she's doing it even more because she's being over the top and theatrical like how Rachel Berry is supposed to be. I remember fans making fun of how she cracks her voice on every note, doing that little yodeling/scooping thing she does way back in season two...

I personally think Lea is one of the best belters I've ever heard. I've always thought of her voice as a Disney Princess voice with power. Celine Dion music is just perfect for her.

It's the rasping that I'm concerned about. Yes, it can sound "sexy" to sound less pure, but it's also a sign of vocal damage and fatigue. I love her crystal clear, bell voice....I hope she stops smoking before she ends up sounding like Stevie Nicks! And I really hope she does not go down the Julie Andrews route.

Naya, IMO, has just the perfect amount of raspiness. Again, I hope she can stop smoking too.

Look at me, trying to tell the cast how to live their lives!  

[ColdFlame96]

I've honestly never really been that impressed by Nayas voice to be honest. She just seems way overrated. She's good, but not like stellar or anything.

[fantastica]

^ who do you like the most among the cast singing wise? i know i am asking for your personal opinions so don't be afraid if anybody disagrees w/ you later.  

i love this discussion. very eye opening (ear opening actually).

[MoviesAreLife]

I've honestly never really been that impressed by Nayas voice to be honest. She just seems way overrated. She's good, but not like stellar or anything.

I love it. I love every single one of the girl's voices. There is so much more diversity in the girls than in the guy's voices...all of the guys sounded the same, except for Kurt and Artie. Maybe it's just because I've always preferred the voices of women and children to men?

Lea's is bright, angelic and powerful. Amber's is bright, powerful and soulful. Naya has that darker tone and that sexy rasp and a good range with low and high notes. Jenna's voice is so sweet, like orange juice. Dianna's is gentle, soft, feminine and old fashioned. I even like Heather's casual pop sound in "My Cup" and "Marry You" and I like her addition to "You Should Be Dancing". Even the new girls are great: Melissa's is jazzy and lower...an alto, though still capable of reaching high notes. She is perfect for Sarah McLachlan music. Becca's is extremely versatile and not nearly as "mousy" as I previously thought. I love them all.

[fantastica]

sorry ladies but i love my cat's meow the most.   it can drive me nuts.

i have no objection over the casts' voices. if the songs are good i may listen. i just want more of colfer's because it's so unique and i can't get enough.

[MoviesAreLife]

sorry ladies but i love my cat's meow the most.   it can drive me nuts.

i have no objection over the casts' voices. if the songs are good i may listen. i just want more of colfer's because it's so unique and i can't get enough.

As for the guys, I want more Kurt and Artie for sure.

[ColdFlame96]

I like Nayas voice just fine, I just don't think she's as amazing as all her stans claim she is. To be honest, Jenna and Dianna are my 2 favorite voices and also the most underrated. Jenna's range is huge and her voice is incredibly versatile. She hits some really low notes in Bad Romance and Born This Way and she could probably go higher than Lea. Dianna is the only alto of the originals, and her voice is like melted butter. Her problem is that the writers have given her songs that have been too high such as Keep Me Hangin On. But she sounds absolutely amazing on the lower notes like in Never Can Say Goodbye.

Chris, Kevin, Matt, and Cory are the best male singers in my opinion, just because they have very distinctive voices from the others.

[MoviesAreLife]

Jenna's voice is so warm and strong. She is one of my favorite voices in the cast. Dianna has a lovely, Marilyn Monroe sound to her...did anyone see the lovely video she posted of herself singing "Hey, Jude"? I love her high harmonies (with Kurt in "One Of Us", with Kevin in "I'm Still Standing") as well as her low ones (Pretty/Unpretty, Love Song).

I forgot about Matt....that guy has RANGE! And Cory was so much better than I ever gave him credit for.

[ColdFlame96]

Jenna's voice is so warm and strong. She is one of my favorite voices in the cast. Dianna has a lovely, Marilyn Monroe sound to her...did anyone see the lovely video she posted of herself singing "Hey, Jude"? I love her high harmonies (with Kurt in "One Of Us") as well as her low ones (Pretty/Unpretty, Love Song).

I forgot about Matt....that guy has RANGE! And Cory was so much better than I ever gave him credit for.  

Don't worry. Everyone forgets about Matt even though he's probably the only true triple threat on the show, along with Becca. I feel really bad for him. They've turned his character into a complete joke.

[Buenos]

Matt is awesome, though I think when he does falsetto it is not his strongest suit. Princes"Kiss" was not great .

Naya is very good within her range, as is Dianna. I think Jenna and Amber have versatile voices, in some ways equal to Lea.

Kevin is great, and I do enjoy Jacob Artist singing in certain numbers. It's a pity if Samuels off the show because I thought that he had an interesting indie/rocker vibe.

[arina]

For me actually Naya is my favorite female singer on the show, I just love her voice, especially lower parts of her range (like in Bad Romance or Hit Me With Your Best Shot /One Way Or Another) do things to meblushh . But I think almost all the girls on the show are amazing and every one of them sounds different which cannot be said about the boys... Jenna I think is the most underreated, that girl is so much versatile and doesn't get enough credit for it.

With boys my favorite is Kevin and then Chris and Cory. If we counts the adults, I admire Matthew singing, he is terrible underused on the show even though he is one of the best in all -  singing, dancing and acting department. Guys like Darren, Chord, "Ryder (I don't remember his real name)" all sounds the same too me and that's boring...

In the original group with Kurt, Finn, Artie and Puck the voices and their styles were much more distinctive one from another and it was much more fun..

[valkeakuulas]

Just out of curiosity: What exactly happened to Julie Andrews' voice? I know she doesn't sing anymore, did she ruin it with her early days singing or smoking?

And what about Bonnie Tyler? She sounds like a ninety year old fisherman, but then again she's always sounded like that.

I appriciate Naya's dark tone too, to be exact any female that has to/can sing low alto. I have a low alto and sometimes it feels all the modern female singers have to sing so high inorder to sound feminine. I like that "old" hazy female voice where you can still hear the beautiful vibrato and difficult, long breaths. A'la Ella Fitzgerald in lets say Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered. (7 minutes of female voice heaven Btw!) That is one of the most difficult songs even though you can't really hear it.

[coxfire]

I appriciate Naya's dark tone too, to be exact any female that has to/can sing low alto. I have a low alto and sometimes it feels all the modern female singers have to sing so high inorder to sound feminine. I like that "old" hazy female voice where you can still hear the beautiful vibrato and difficult, long breaths. A'la Ella Fitzgerald in lets say Bewitched, Bothered and Bewildered. (7 minutes of female voice heaven Btw!) That is one of the most difficult songs even though you can't really hear it.

I am exactly the same, I prefer women with lower voices, like PJ Harvey, Shirley Manson from Garbage, or Sarah Bettens from K's choice. But more generally, in a matter of singing, I don't really care if the voice sounds "perfect" or very neat, I rather focus on the emotion the singer is able to vehicle, if that makes sense. Most of the bands I listen to are rock bands, and rock singers are not necessarily trained ones, but I couldn't imagine anyone else singing their song.

[AnneNeville]

If Chris *did* smoke, it would be a disaster . . . his voice is his signature, and while it might be tempting to "lower" his speaking voice by smoking (a reason given to me by a famous actress who was afraid to quit and lose her signature "raspiness"), it would be a terrible idea to mar his singing voice. He'd lose his high notes pretty fast, I bet.

I wonder if smoking is part of why Chord has aged so much during this past year. It's remarkable.

[Buenos]

I thought Julie Andrews lost her singing voice after a botched surgery, though it may have been more complicated than that.

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