Re: 5x03 "The Quarterback" Watch & Discussion thread

[Buenos]

No episode was ever going to match everyone's expectations.

I was moved, even while I disagreed with some of the usual Glee characterizations and inconsistent writing and weird reactions.

The Carole/Burt/Kurt scene was just so tough emotionally and the dialogue was spot on. The acting was flawless,really what can one say?

Seasons of Love was beautiful, everything on how the number was staged with looking back at the wall display of Finn, that was the best group moment by far of the whole episode.

And who would have known that the best current ND male singing combo is Artie and Sam. Everyone knows I"m not a huge Chord fan but he and Kevin sounded nice together.

While the snark between Kurt and Puck was a bit odd, somehow it worked for me. Though I hated how outside of Beistie, nobody really reached out for Puck.

Kurt's exposition dialogue is some of the hardest things to do in episodes like this, it's fine line between not over acting and yet trying to convey the emotion. Of course he did it beautifully. It was classic Kurt, holding it and reserved and yet you could still see the pain and anguish beneath the facade.

[bayth]

Ratings are in and as expected Glee had great numbers:

[Jellyrolls]

As I've thought more about the episode today, I have to say that it was right not to have Kurt sing. Kurt was really the connection and pillar of strength among all of the side stories (except for Will's). If Kurt had sung, I think in addition to this, I think it would have taken too much focus off of Finn. I think that also rings true for Will to a lesser extent.

[coxfire]

I just watched it. I didn't cry all episode long, but the Hummel-Hudson was really hard to watch, Romy broke my heart, and the dialogue was so spot on, it was really, really heart wrenching.

Kevin's grief was also something that stood out, I could feel how sad he was through the screen.

I didn't like how everyone treated Puck either. His locker scene with Bieste was weirdly written, but Coach's words "he's dead and he's just a voice in our heads" was also a line that I found powerful.

Incidentally, the rest didn't affect that much. I hated the Tina plot, stop throwing garbage at her. I get what they were doing with Santana and Sue, but I didn't like that Kurt gave the jacket to Santana. I got why he would keep it, but not why he would give it to her rather than Puck.

Kurt/Chris was exactly how I pictured him: withdrawn, almost closed-off. I know Shue was the one portrayed as "strong for the others", but Kurt really was too.

Finally, Rachel... I was sad for her/Lea, but her scenes weren't those that I found the most powerful.

[Ranwing]

In regards to Tina's rather pointless scene... I think I was getting what they were trying to go for with that scene in Emma's office (and did really badly). Finn has been gone for several weeks now and Tina has apparently felt almost obligated to continue with active mourning (thus the wearing black all the time). I think that Tina was asking when it's okay to start moving on and having life start returning to normal (or at least as normal as life can be after the death of a friend) and it would have been a very good question to be asked. Weeks of mourning and memorializing is difficult at best and it's hard when you feel like you're the first one who's ready to start resuming life. Who wants to be the first to stop mourning if everyone else is because then you think it reflects badly on you - that you didn't care as much.

She could have taken a good cue from Kurt, who apparently never stopped with his life despite losing his step brother. Kurt was still grieving, but he wasn't wearing widow's weeds and he was bouncing back and forth between NY and Lima (indicating that he was still dealing with school and work). I wish that Emma could have been a bit more perceptive to what Tina really seemed to be asking rather than just foisitng a bunch of pamplets on her that just made her look like a self-centered bitch.

[Buenos]

Yeah, the Tina/Emma scene was a tough one, they were going for both humor and an insightful point about moving forward, but it did just make Tina look like a bitch for the 100th time. Jenna wasn't bad in the scene actually though and I did like the reference to season 1 Goth Tina.

[coxfire]

There were lots of nice references to the previous seasons, the good ones, you know. One that made me smile was Bieste saying Finn would have kicked a chair and Puck confirming it was Finn's trademark.

[brisallie]

P.S As I got late, I searched the episode online and I had to stop it because the beginning with Seasons of Love already broke me down. For me that moment is the Glee Cast saying goodbye to Cory  

It was the cast saying goodbye, not the characters. At least that's how it seemed to me, and I also think that's how they wanted it to seem.
I was weirded out by the new ND characters starting the song because they are definitely not on the track, so I think it would have been better if Chris, Naya, Harry, Jenna, Amber and Mark had been visible among them from the very beginning, but I'll take it.
I also would have wished that the adult actors had been in that scene, at least Matt and Jane.

Can I be honest? When the song started with the newbies, I felt upset because I wanted that song being focused only on the old gang, but then I realized this perfomance was intended to be as a farewell from the actors, not the characters, to his dear friend. And probably that why I wanted to see Jane, Matt, Jayma, Dot and Lea in the performance as well. But still, it broke me down.

@Ranwing, I really like your psychological analisis and how both Rachel and Kurt could learn something from Finn's loss. You know also it took me by surprise that Rachel expected that after being sucessful in Broadway she will going back to Lima and Finn was gonna be there still waiting for her. I'm sorry, and though Finn was someone kinda insecure, I thought that after found his purpose in life, teaching, he would be ready to move on and probably  finds a girl who actually wanted to compromise and put the relationship in first place. I think Rachel gives for granted that people gonna be there forever, but other people also have dreams and speaking about this, that something I want Kurt to learn, I want Kurt to follow HIS dreams, not the dreams of someone else. Sometimes he's so acquiescent.

As regards Santana, foremost I've to say that Naya did well in her dramatic scenes, she definitely surprised me. But still is hard for me to understand all of this sorrowful sadness she felt for Finn's death. I know at some point they apologized to each other for the rude things they had said in the past, but that didn't avoid me to had  disapproval feelings when she said to Sue she never had something nice to say toward Finn, because Santana used to do the same, before they started to get along well, or at least being more respectful between them. It justl like... I've the impression that some of those scenes should have be done by Quinn. However, as some have pointed, this probably was Santana trying to figure out how to react when someone you have met and somehow you have a connection with, is dead. And she did it the "best" way she can do it and is trying to hold back her emotions, but at the is hard for her to struggle with the feeling, and explode. The same goes for Puck, but  he and Finn were besties.

Also I want to say at some points I felt like I was seeing more the actors than the characters, for instance that voice-over that Kurt had at the beginning it was like Chris felt in real life. I remember he said something similar in an interview. And something I've reading a lot, but are mostly critics, is this episode didn't have a coherent plotline and I agree,for instance I would have ended the Prom episode with a call saying that Finn is death, as a way to connect it with this one. But by other side, I see this episode like those special ones that are not totally related to the other ones.

[Ranwing]

If I had to pick a favorite line, it was the observation that the line on Finn's memorial between the year of his birth and death was the meaningful one. The symbol that contained all of the things that Finn did and was, and Bieste's urging for Puck to have a "good line" really resonated with me. It fits in with the whole message that it's the life that you life and not the length of that life or how that life ended is important and to make the most of whatever time you have.

That ended Puck's story on a very positive note for me and I'm happy that the guy who started off the show basically as a human wreaking ball now finally has some direction and even purpose.

[tanita_mors]

that was ... i don't think i have every cried so hard during an episode of any tv show. it started with seasons of love, it continued with that flawless kurt/burt/carole scene, it intensified during no surrender and ended sometime after will completely lost it with the jacket. god, that was gut-wrenching. i may write more later or tomorrow when i can collect my thoughts and comment fully on the episode, but given the kind of circus glee can be, this was a thoughtful and beautiful send of for finn but even more for cory. chris, naya, jane, mark and lea in the last 10 minutes carried this episode to perfection.

[brisallie]

...

That ended Puck's story on a very positive note for me and I'm happy that the guy who started off the show basically as a human wreaking ball now finally has some direction and even purpose.

This.

You know, when I saw the dumpster scene with him and Kurt, it hit me how different is the Puck from that scene and the current one. He used to be the bully jock who had also misbehaviour issues, and now he's someone who is growing up as a person, and I think he deserves a good life, because he had realizes if he makes a change, he could have good opportunties. And can I add how much I love his friendship with Beiste, is a friendship I never saw coming, but it works well for me

And aside of the sadness, some of you don't feel upset that writers can actually write good episodes when they put their heart on it? Why don't they do this more often? Why do we have this episodes only when something tragic happen?

[Glorfindel]

Kevin's grief was also something that stood out, I could feel how sad he was through the screen.

Kevin's grief was almost palpable throughout the episode, also in the PSA. I'm actually glad they gave Artie no storyline because that would have been so hard on Kevin, and the viewers too.
His duet with Chord was lovely, though.

Finally, Rachel... I was sad for her/Lea, but her scenes weren't those that I found the most powerful.

Me neither. Maybe because of the interviews of the past few days that ticked me off, maybe because I just shut out Lea's emotions because she was clearly so sad while filming her scenes and I felt voyeuristic.

I'm also not going to speculate on which actor was 'really' emotional in which scene (besides e.g. noticing that Kevin had it rough throughout), because I need this episode to be about Finn and all the characters I love, like Kurt, Rachel, Puck and Will.
I know these characters for 4-5 years now, but I don't really know Chris, Lea, Mark or Matt, and if I have to think of them (the real people) while watching these scenes it feels like I'm intruding and assuming to understand them, when I don't.

There were lots of nice references to the previous seasons, the good ones, you know. One that made me smile was Bieste saying Finn would have kicked a chair and Puck confirming it was Finn's trademark.

Yes, I loved that too. Also the throw back to football win with Single Ladies, Finn singing to a sonogram, and the 'faggy' lamp.

The quote they put on the plaque was also wonderful. Someone must have remembered that or have gone back through old episodes to find it, and it described who Finn was perfectly.

All I needed was a line from Mike telling how much he would miss Finn's awkward dancing.

[brisallie]

...

All I needed was a line from Mike telling how much he would miss Finn's awkward dancing.

 That would have been perfect. I know this is actually a reference to Cory, but it also can be addressed to Finn, but I remember a pic/gif made by fans, and he's in heaven and even there he can't dance. Poor boy.

And please, can anyone tell me in what episode he said "The show must go all over the places...", I remember he said that, but I totally forgot the episode. I guess it was season one.

[ChrisColferFan1]

I am watching this episode now.

[valkeakuulas]

I thought that as an entirety The Quarterbeck was one of the best episodes in Glee for awhile but at the same time I felt a little bit awkward watching it because it was 44 minutes of...I don't know how to say it without sounding callous, it felt an episode of longed out drama crying. It did what it was intented to do, make you cry but some of the group shots in the choir room were just uncomfortable. Wether that was because of real tears or badly acted tears I don't know because I did avert my eyes a lot from the screen during the numbers.

Even Hudson-Hummel household scene felt really long, but in Glee time, those four minutes were really long and painful. And talking about Kurt being the tying factor in the episode, I did miss a proper scene between Rachel and Kurt in the end. I know they now say Finn will not be dropped from the storylines so Hummelberry might have time to talk about this. For some reason wanted either of them to end the episode, not Will. That is the illusion that comes from watching Kurt edits only, he's lost his meaning as a character for me.

All in all it was an odd episode for me. Rachel's song was a special song for me for other reasons and perhaps because of that it felt like an normal number for me. Other songs were just songs, I perhaps wanted different songs and couldn't really connect these choices for a memorial numbers.

[Ranwing]

For me, the primary reason that some of Rachel's scenes lost their punch was the simple fact that while she might have loved Finn and he might have been the love of her life, they haven't been together in quite some time. And Rachel had been very insistant that the stage was her first love and really did nothing to try to ensure that she could have both the stage and Finn. Yes, Finn certainly made more than his fair share of mistakes in their relationship, but the choices that made it impossible for Finn to be with Rachel were made primarily by Rachel. Again, I have no issue with her being ambitious and in the end deciding to persue her professional aspirations over her relationship with Finn, but she did make that choice. She was the one who had the clear goal that she would not deviate from a single iota in order to give Finn a chance to follow. So for her to be held up as some kind of martyr just doesn't work for me. I'm sympathetic for her, and I don't doubt her pain but I won't pull punches in that the choice to end things with Finn was primarily hers and she had done nothing since TBU to facilitate a reconciliation.

I made a point earlier that Rachel's dream about eventually reconnecting with Finn after she had achieved all of her dreams was, to say the very least, unrealistic. The idea that Finn would basically be waiting in Lima and doing his thing on the off chance that 10 or 15 years down the road Rachel would flit back into his life and want to settle down because she's had enough of the spotlight was... I really hate to say this... selfish on Rachel's part. The reality is that most likely she and Finn would never have gotten back together and they both would have found partners that fit in with their lives and aspirations. Rachel's having her cake and eating it too was a self-indulgent fantasy and allowed her to go after what she wanted without having to worry that it would impact Finn negatively because she planned to return and pick up Finn later like a forgotten toy.

Again, this is not to say that Rachel didn't genuinely love Finn and isn't deeply mourning him, but the fact that they weren't togehter at the time he died, hadn't been together for a very long time and were very likely not going to get back together. Rachel is mourning the loss of her fantasy, but it was fantasy that was highly unlikely to ever come to pass.

[tanita_mors]

I felt a little bit awkward watching it because it was 44 minutes of...I don't know how to say it without sounding callous, it felt an episode of longed out drama crying.

^^^ the word you are looking for is "grief porn".

i agree, and yet, as far as i'm concerned, that is what we needed. it was by no means a perfect flawless episode, but it was as closed to it as this show is ever going to get. and i applaud that.

[tanita_mors]

but you know, it's because it was a fantasy it hurts so much. because it was perfect and will remain perfect in her mind forever. had they had time to explore their lives, both of them would have discovered that that fantasy was unreachable by any standard. with finn gone, the fantasy is all that is left.

[Ranwing]

but you know, it's because it was a fantasy it hurts so much. because it was perfect and will remain perfect in her mind forever. had they had time to explore their lives, both of them would have discovered that that fantasy was unreachable by any standard. with finn gone, the fantasy is all that is left.

Exactly. Rachel is mourning the "might have been" as much as she's actually mourning Finn himself.

I'm expecting that there is going to be a lot of emotional fallout over the course of the season that can be traced back to losing Finn. It would make sense for people to use this occassion as a chance to reassess their priorities in life and what they really want and there is no one who needs to do that more than Rachel. She threw away whatever chance she had to be with Finn because she refused to bend just a little bit. How often has she been careless and thrown aside relationships with those that she cared about because they momentarily were in the way of what she wanted and then having to go back to try to fix the damage she'd done. How often had she disregarded her friendship with Kurt, and now still be friends primarily because Kurt cared enough to fix what she carelessly breaks.

If Rachel emerges a more thoughtful, deliberate individual who still can go after her dreams but without causing the kind of harm that she does so carelessly, then this can be a chance for her to really grow as an individual. Let her start thinking before she acts and start really asking question if the momentary gains are worth the loss of the hard won personal relationships that she had gained since the pilot. She's already lost Finn. I want to see her want to hang on to the ones that she still has, like Kurt.

[brisallie]

@Ranwing, can I be honest? Sometimes I feel you don't like Rachel at all. But probably I had that impression because you're being simply honest of how you see Rachel (os she actually is), and is kinda ironic that something I like from Rachel and that she's not the typical "heroin" that is loved by everyone and is perfect. However, are precisely those characteristics that could be funny at first like her self-centric personality, that at the end will be her worst enemy. As I said some posts ago, she can't expect people are gonna be there all her life, I know truly friendships can last for years, but not when you put them aside. I know that being ambition isn't that bad, but does she prefer to be sucessfull alone or with friends and a family to share with?

[Ranwing]

brisallie - I will admit that my feelings for Rachel are very, very mixed. There are times when I like her a great deal and there are times when I wished that someone would club her over the head a few times with a big rock. But I do find her a deeply interesting, deeply flawed character. I get highly frustrated with how easily she wins things (and how often logic that applies to everyone else gets thrown out the window where she is concerned), but that comes more from the place that I hate bad story telling and cheap contrivences. I want to root for Rachel but so often find that I can't because it's like rooting for the one participant in a one horse race.

I completely agree that Rachel herself is the source of so many of her problems. She has such a huge blind spot when it comes to how she deals with people. I totally get how this painfully awkward girl who grew up apparently having no friends (and thus never learned how to really be a friend) wants so much so badly and has no clue at how to balance it all out. I want to see her grow and evolve and become a better person. The show, unfortunately, short changes both her and us by not letting her grow. They don't let her deal with any real consequences of her decisions or mistakes. Except now.

Sadly, by virtue of Cory being gone, Rachel can't go back and fix the mistakes she made in her relationship with Finn. She made a lot of decisions that just can't be undone of fixed now and for the first time, her character is really going to have to live with the consequences of her choices. My hope is that Rachel can really learn from this and that the writers will let you learn that things don't come without cost and if you always choose yourself over those that you're supposed to love, eventually you'll find yourself alone.

[Buenos]

Real life has changed the trajectory of Rachel Berry on Glee.

In my mind, she was going to get Broadway stardom and Finn, for her happily ever after.

That is not possible now, but will stardom be enough for Rachel? We'll have to wait and see.

[ChrisColferFan1]

The episode was one of the best. Good but sad. In my opinion the episode could of been a bit better, but still a very good episode. Although, I like this episode. I wish it did not have to be made in the 1st place.

[jaime20]

Can I ask about the PSA? Who did them and were they about drugs abuse?

[jaime20]

Thank you! I'll try to join the discussions as soon as possible.

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