Bistro on the corner

Here is my own spin, every human being is wired different, just like we all have different finger prints, we all have a different chemical makeup.

How much of what we  become  is genetics versus environment is the eternal debate.  

I just think every human being has to battle demons on some level in their life and I hate to see the demons "win" in any case.   To me that is a tragedy, but I honestly don't know how complicit anyone is in any addiction.   Regardless, for our society to function people have to be responsible for their actions, you can't murder others because you had a crappy childhood.  I think there are choices, and even if you are chemically more  predisposed for addiction an individual in many cases can "chose" not to take that first step, realizing that there could be consequences they cannot control down the line.

Someone starting out  in the arts, and sees what happened to Cory Monteith, Heath Ledger and Philip Seymour  realizes what can happen with addiction.  IF they choose to start taking drugs you can't say  it was not a choice.

It's so hard when emotions run high.  I agree it's a tragedy to the family and friends.  However to those who appreciated his gifts as a actor, the waste of such potential by drug addiction is a tragedy. That a person is complicit in this waste is why I think it's a tragedy.  The arts matter and losing gifted people like Seymour matters.  It could have been a great composer, or writer and I would think the same thing.   It's a lose/lose when people (not you Ranwing) split hairs on terms.

Same thing with mental illness, my heart goes on to loved ones of those who killed themselves or harmed others, but I find it so hard to not empathize with the demons the individual is battling. (yes I know that is not the same as drug addiction)

The first step is indeed the most important one, as one opens oneself up to a risk they are at that moment willingly taking. And someone who has everything going for them choosing that path is imo stupid.
However, not everyone is that fortunate. In some environments, in some childhoods, with some mental illnesses, etc. that first step is all too easy to take, and at first sight seems to be a solution, an escape, a relief. It's tempting and these kids really have no support system to fall on in their loneliest times, or their support system consists of the 'wrong' friends.
Add the lack of good education and warnings and that choice will be made by a lot of these influencable youngsters. It's one stupid mistake they shouldn't have made that will effect the rest of their lives.

Let me clarify that I still think that stepping into that trap willingly is stupid, but it's human, and it happens.
After that, once the addiction is a fact, it becomes an illness that even those who choose to fight it and stay clean for the rest of their lives never really can ever heal from.

I think good education and sadly the examples these celebrities who die from addiction become are important.
My parents smoked cigarettes for all the 21 years I lived with them while I grew up. In our home there constantly hung a smoke cloud in the living room. My father had had lung surgery as a young man (tuberculose) and he hardly had any breath left to begin with, but he still smoked like a chimney. Eventually he died much too young, when I was 24, simply because his lungs gave up. My mom stopped smoking right after his funeral. She had tried stopping before and I saw her struggling and failing each time. She started smoking as an adolescent (like so many kids did back then) and it's really hard to stop an addiction that went on for so long. Untill my dad died, that is: then she stopped cold and never smoked again. Now she detests the smell of cigarettes.

What I'm trying to say: because I saw all this, grew up with that horrible smell in the house and the coughing my dad would do, I never touched a cigarette in my life, nor did my brother and sister.
If celebrities who died much too young of drugs or other addictions (like alcohol) make people, kids, aware of the dangers, then at least a little bit of good will come from these awful deaths.

But dammit: how many still have to die before the message drives home?
And how long will the entertainment industry in Hollywood keep handing out drugs like candy at parties, and condone and cover for the addicts in their own working places? They're enablers.
How long will the studios keep overworking and pressuring their artists to e.g. stay thin or constantly popular/in the public eye, so they resort to drugs (to lose weight), painkillers and/or sleeping pills to simply get through the day?

Sorry to change the subject but I was going through the pervious pages and wanted to respond to this:

fantastica wrote:i am getting old.    my sight is deteriorating. i am stubbornly refusing to get glasses. i can still read cell phone or even tiny text but not under very dim light. but my distant vision is getting fuzzy. i am relying on my GPS navigator to tell me "turn right", "merge left" rather than reading signs.   

As Glorfindel said, glasses really do help. I've worn them almost my whole life (got my first pair when I was about 4 or 5 years old) and each time I've gotten a new pair, I can notice a differance. I've always trouble seeing far and when I don't wear my glasses, stuff looks blurry.

Marie, I totally get what you are saying. And I agree with a lot of it. Environment and exposure do have a lot to do with a person becoming addicted in the first place, and then relapsing later in recovery. But I cannot divorce personal responsibility from the equation. Knowing that he had this issue and having already been in rehab last year (for a paltry 10 days, which no expert would believe is sufficient), Hoffman didn't seek out help when he was slipping again. Given the amount of drugs found at the time of his death, he wasn't just using. He was binging. And he made the choice not to seek out help when he was losing control.

We have lost so many great talents to addiction in the past few years. We lost Heath Leger, Amy Winehouse, Cory and now Hoffman. The manner of their deaths doesn't take away from their remarkable talents and they should, rightly, be celebrated for their accomplishments. But their deaths should not be regarded as anything other than a huge warning to other performers. That they can't keep playing with fire and not expect to get burned. For an actor of Hoffman's stature to die alone on his bathroom floor with the needle still in his arm should be a horrifying image to anyone.

I said that with Cory's passing that the manner of his death doesn't make up the sum total of his worth as a person and I meant it. The same with Hoffman. But it is a part of the equation that cannot be ignored. Nor should it be celebrated.

^Add Whitney Houston to those celebrities.

And I agree Wendy, that they eventually all were for the most part responsible for their own actions. How much so is hard to say, as we can't really understand how severe a disease addiction becomes, and how hard it is to control for years on end. But still..... they did it to themselves.

And unlike the troubled kids who fall into the trap at a very young age, these celebrities were adults when they relapsed. And also unlike these kids: they had the money and means to seek good help for their addiction, and also the support. They were able to fight their addiction for many years, and part of me doesn't understand why they then still eventually relapsed and lost the fight.
But then again: what could be a small bump in the road for most people could be an enormous mountain to climb for someone else, and these people were already fighting a trench war to begin with.

So, even though I think it's stupid (sorry, I have no other name for it that expresses my feelings about this), I can't judge other people's struggles.
I can admire their work and (certainly in the case of Cory) appreciate how kind they were to others, but their deaths are so unnecessary untimely and such a waste.

Right now actor Jared Padalecki is taking a lot of heat for tweeting that he didn't consider JSH's death a tragedy, and called it "stupid". While his timing was awful (the day that they found Hoffman's body), I can't say he was totally wrong. For a man with young children to go so compelely off the bend is stupid. And selfish. Jared isn't the only one who was more critical of JSH, but he's the biggest name so he's taking all the flack.

There have been some who have argued that we've gone too far in considering addiction a disease and therefore stripping all sense of personal responsibility from those struggling with addiction. As someone who had to struggle with mental health issues, I do understand better than most how hard it is to deal with those kinds of complusions. But it didn't take away from my responsibilty that I had to deal with it because I was affecting not only myself but my family as well. If you want to see it strictly from a disease standpoint (and some have likened addiction to cancer), you have the choice of either treating your disease or letting it run rampent until it kills you. Hoffman chose not to treat and therefore bears responsibility for the pain that his family is going through right now.

I think that Hoffman's work should rightly be celebrated and he should be honored for his accomplishments. But just as I argued after Amy Winehouse died (and who didn't see that coming from a mile away), the manner in which he died must not be celebrated. It's sometimes hard to seperate the two, but as much as I admired Hoffman (and Cory and Whitney), their legacy's are tainted somewhat by the manner in which they died. Hoffman didn't die from something unpreventable (like inoperable cancer). He died from something completely unnecessary and thus I have to agree with Jared that his passing was a waste of a great talent.

Well Ernest Hemingway shot himself and many great writers back in the day basically drank themselves to death ( F Scott Fitzgerald) since many were IMO alcoholics.

Ditto the lives of Edith Piaf, Billie Holliday and Judy Garland. While he survived for years, don't get me started on Chet Baker. Or Jimi Hendrix, Janis Joplin.

So I've always 'tried' separating artist's body of work from their personal lives which can be quite messy. Maybe because I don't usually think they're heroes or role models for all their artistic gifts. While I can't help but think of Amy's early demise, for example, I can listen to her music and appreciate it. Of course I think what a waste of a talent but that's human nature to think of that.

^Or the celebrities who drove their cars too fast and crashed.


What's the real tragedy in the end is the mourning the ones having to deal with the loss of a dear one have to go through.
That's tragic regardless of the way people died.

Just to clarify: Jared Padalecki did not say that he did not think it was a tragedy. That is what he said when he was back pedaling like crazy. He said it was stupid. And that he woyldnt call it 'sad'. And I am sorry but saying that, in a public sphere within hours of the announcement, makes him a total dick.

Georgette888 wrote:Just to clarify: Jared Padalecki did not say that he did not think it was a tragedy. That is what he said when he was back pedaling like crazy. He said it was stupid. And that he woyldnt call it 'sad'. And I am sorry but saying that, in a public sphere within hours of the announcement, makes him a total dick.

You know I love SPN, but I sincerely believe that Jared should had keep his hands away from the keyboard. Got it, everybody is free to express their opinion, but what he said sounded insensitive. No matter how somenone died, for me is still sad, and at the moment he tweeted the comment everything was so recently.

The reality is that when someone does something that directly causes his death, like taking illegal drugs, not everyone is going to be overly sympathetic. Working in a cancer hospital, I'm aware that there are quite a few cancers that are directly related to personal behavior (like smoking) and that you have to refrain from making judgement calls. We all do things that are detrimental to our health, but taking drugs really is in a whole other sphere. I fully understand why Jared feels the way he does (and don't totally disagree with him) and he certainly has a right to consider how Hoffman died stupid or a waste. His timing and lack of tact do, however, leave a lot to be desired and he's been soundly called out on it. The sad thing is that he's not a dick (and having had the pleasure of meeting him a a con, and he really is a sweet and considerate person. Twitter can make anyone look like a complete asshole, unfortunately.

JSH did not have to die. He could (and should) have recognized that he had lost any control and gotten himself checked into rehab ASAP. Now we're finding out that he had been taking anti-addiction medications (which are supposed to block the effects of narcotics so an addict finds them less desirable) and the odds are that if he had used this medication that he had taken larger doses of the drug in order to override the threshhold. The story just gets more pathetic and more sorid as the details come out. Had he accepted that he was back in the deepest grip of his addiction and gotten the intensive help he needed he would not only be alive, but would be lauded for seeking the help he needed. Now he's dead in the most degrading manner possible, and people are going to pass some rather harsh judgement. Jared was right about one thing... for an actor this talented to die for something so pointless and so preventable, it is stupid.

That can be disputed until people are blue in the face but to say it is not 'sad' that a talented, well loved man has died, within a couple of hours of said death in a public forum where he knows it will be reported upon and said dead man's loved ones are likely to hear of his words, makes him stupid and a insensitive dick, imo. The whys and wherefores of the drug situation and lifestyles choices are by the by. 140 characters, hours after the announcement, by an actor? Not his fucking place and certainly not the time. If he isn't a dick, he needs to get off twitter until he stops looking like one. For his own good.

@Ranwing, I was also partly agree with Jared when it comes to the use of the word 'tragedy', for me that word implies something more unavoidable, and in this case, I try to not judge PSH so harshly, he was the one who decided to use drugs that day. I try to not be harsh, because we still don't know what were the reasons behind (he was clean for 23 years). Going back to Jared, what I didn't like was he said the dead of PSH wasn't sad, for me that sounded insensitive and I think what he had to do was to think more carefully his words, because not many people took it so well, I included. And though I've seen videos of him in conventions and seems like a sweet goofy guy, by other side I see him as someone who just spit out his words.

Georgette888 wrote:That can be disputed until people are blue in the face but to say it is not 'sad' that a talented, well loved man has died, within a couple of hours of said death in a public forum where he knows it will be reported upon and said dead man's loved ones are likely to hear of his words, makes him stupid and a insensitive dick, imo. The whys and wherefores of the drug situation and lifestyles choices are by the by. 140 characters, hours after the announcement, by an actor? Not his fucking place and certainly not the time. If he isn't a dick, he needs to get off twitter until he stops looking like one. For his own good.

Totally agree with that. Jared's first tweet was uncalled for and insensitive towards the people close to him who were grieving and frankly still in shock only hours after he died.

I get the sentiment behind the tweet, but the timing and wording were absolutely horrible.

Jared was right about one thing... for an actor this talented to die for something so pointless and so preventable, it is stupid.

Sorry Ranwing, but to me Jared doesn't pass the 'common sense/tact' rule.  That he's a 10 year savvy TV actor veteran of a rabid fanbase (Supernatural) where every word and utterance is scrutinized for meaning, and uttered publicly what he did( and privately he can have his own opinions/reservations about the issue but to say what he did knowing friends/family of the deceased could read it).  Not sure what is worse, if he's just that stupid or just an asshole.  I hope for his fans sake he's not a stupid asshole.

Talking about assholes,

http://instagram.com/p/kAvsW2M_wK/

msamberpriley

29 minutes ago
"Fucking monkeys still doing tricks master taught them. Thinking she can speak to me. Their day is coming" I walked in and grabbed my gloves and said "have a blessed night ladies". I forgot this type of ignorance still existed. I didn't even for a moment think the reason she looked at me with such disdain was because I was black. I forgot everyone isn't as free as the rest of us mentally. That's why I thank God for black history month, it reminds me of how far we have all come in the states. It keeps me encouraged in moments like this. I wasn't even angry, I was sad. She'll never know the friends she may miss because she can't get pass something as inconsequential as color. I am so glad that I was taught to love beyond my differences to others. Thanks mom and dad. I could never live a life of such ignorance. Now I'm going to go sit at a table for dinner with all different colors and races and laugh and talk with my friends. Happy Black History Month, let's continue to grow together

Amber is far too classy , I would have.....  

I am just speechless. Amber, you are one classy lady. And one amazing role model for young women, black and white.

Amber is a goddess and deserves a lot better than how this show has treated her this past season. Hopefully her arrival in the NY storyline will be as a regular and not just for glorified cameos.

What an amazing positive attitude she has. I bow to you, Amber: if the world had more people like you it'd be a much better place.

I agree. Amber is a girl who is able to deal with douchebags as a classic lady, and that something I admire.

Interesting new story in this weeks issue of Newsday, about homophobia in the figure skating community (along with a great picture ofJohnny Weir on the cover). In a nutshell, stating that for a sport that has a reputation for having so many gay male athletes (part trope/part reality) that it is extremely difficult for gay althetes to be out and be treated fairly in competition. And those that are out or pecieved to be gay face a lot of discrimination in the sport.

I remember in the last winter Olympics seeing Johnny Weir skating one of the most gorgeous programs with no real errors (falls or missed jumps) and then seeing his scores and believing that he was badly underscored, and placed out of medal contention even though he skated a cleaner program that several skaters who were placed ahead of him in the final ranking. And given that there have been only 2 male skaters who were out during their competative careers (Wier and Rudy Galindo) in the US, the implication for athletes is pretty clear to stay in the closet if they want to stay competative.

I used to follow figure skating back in the day, even went to competitions (you know you're hooked if you take notes at practices)  and there was this weird dichotomy on the reality of mens figure skating versus how repressed and unspoken things were.

It was just so bizarre yet it was the norm and was accepted by everyone.  For example , Brian Boitano being gay was just so universally a given, yet for years his reticence to the point of saying he didn't personally know any gay skaters was so surreal.  Brian knew the rules and lived by them, I can't really judge him yet nobody was fooled.

It continues to this day, which is why the Evan Lysacek / Johnny Weir " feud" has so many issues/baggage.

Talk about waste, Chris Bowman the ex national champ who died of a drug overdose 6 years ago at the age of 40 was considered as naturally talented as anyone in the sport. He was indulged in the sport for so long because he was perceived as unequivocally straight.

I remember a big to do over a sportscaster who was mocking Weir for skating "like a girl". The prejudice against openly male figure skaters who are still viable competators is very, very real and I don't doubt that it affected how Weir was scored at the last Olympics. Which is a shame because he is one of the most beautifully artisic skaters.

This was his long program and it is absolutely gorgeous. He doesn't just do jumps and tricks, but skates with remarkable beauty. It's the total package that skaters should be striving for.

Ranwing wrote:I remember a big to do over a sportscaster who was mocking Weir for skating "like a girl". The prejudice against openly male figure skaters who are still viable competators is very, very real and I don't doubt that it affected how Weir was scored at the last Olympics. Which is a shame because he is one of the most beautifully artisic skaters.

This was his long program and it is absolutely gorgeous. He doesn't just do jumps and tricks, but skates with remarkable beauty. It's the total package that skaters should be striving for.

Skating is such a subjective sport and the pull of the athletic versus presentation ( in old days "artistry") is what makes it fascinating .

What I loved about Weir's skating is that he managed to balance the two. His jumps were beautifully clean, with great combinations and fulfilling all the athletic requirements that were standard at the time he was competing (quad jumps were starting to become standard in programs), but he did these elements with so much grace. I do agree that being a subjective judging sport there is always the issue of biases coming into play, with Weir being penalized because he didn't skate the way a judge might want to see a man skate.

It's going to be interesting to see him in Sochi. Glad that the network televising the Olympics signed him on as a skating commentator. I've seen him do the commentary at some events this season that he's really great at the job because he explains things from a skater's perspective and explains why something worked (or didn't work).