Re: 4x01 "The New Rachel" Watch & Discussion thread

[Kurt Hummel]

I thought the episode was pretty good. Loved seeing Kurt and Sue's baby.
Not a fan of Kitty.
I loved It's Time! So many Klaine feelings! I've that song on repeat.
I also agree with Kurt, Burt is the greatest dad.
I thought see Kurt work at The Lima Bean was cute.
I also thought Jake had a pretty great voice.

[valkeakuulas]

I believe Hummelberry will outdo Brochel as Lea has tons of chemistry with Chris. I am hoping no-one really cares about Rachel being Brody and want more and more Hummelberry.

They can keep trying with Rachel and Brody, but I don't think it will work. There isn't that dynamic that Lea has with Chris and Corey.

Your thoughts about NTBND were interesting and it's really fun to hear new ideas and mind set about our favorite performances. I love it that we can also analyse Kurt here, not just always send hearts around and appriciate.

That's why no matter how much I hate Brad as Kurt's writer he stirs the pot a bit since Ryan perhaps loves Kurt too much. Same goes for Ryan needing to do the writing for Finchel because Brad loves too much of them as well. There sometimes is twisted logic to Glee if only they'd sometimes hold on to the continuity of the characters and remember what each of them have actually given to the plots.

But yes favortism for Hummelberry by Ryan? Yes and that's a big YES! He can see the friendship well even though I still maintain that if asked bluntly from the fanon Kurt would say his best friend in high school was Mercedes. Hummelberry works because they have/had same aspirations and battle path, which again RIB forgot when they were writing their own little bits of Glee.

Ryan writes the underdogs well and I suppose, dispite being a teeny tiny bit cliche, Marley and her mom were proper underdogs as well as Sam really, while the rest turned out to be bitches for popularity and fame. But giving still acting kudos for most of them, their faces when the jocks were insulting the mom were convincing about the insecurity of their actions.

[Glorfindel]

I know I am going to be the minority here, but I actually liked this episode.

I liked it too, and if you look at the poll I think it's not a real minority opinion.

And I felt as Ryan wrote this that he put more care and love into the Kurt and Burt scene than any of the other scenes in the episode. It was perfect, it was beautiful.

Brad likes to torture Kurt and stretch it out. The scenes weren't that painful, because they weren't extended, they were short, and you felt Kurt did not belong in Lima.
(---)
I do think Ryan is trying to fix the mess Brad made, and we will eventually see Kurt get into Nyada.
(---)
I do think the spin off, Ryan still wants it to happen, but with Kurt and Rachel.

Keck said Vogue is a detour, maybe that is what it is.
(---)
I only want Ryan writing for Kurt, I don't trust Brad.

I think you're right here. Ryan has always loved Kurt, and though he has written him getting failure and hurt for storylines' sake (like in 'Wheels','Theatricality', 'I am Unicorn') he has always made sure that the audience knew that Kurt was mistreated and that he was not alone. Now, in 'The New Rachel' he showed a down and getting ridiculed/humiliated Kurt, but although I didn't like the Kitty/Sue scene, Kurt still held himself upright and the scenes were brief, only to show Kurt's rightfully depressed state, and after getting no POV from Kurt in 'Goodbye' I'm glad they showed his feelings in 'The New Rachel', even when they weren't good feelings.

And I really fear getting my hopes up, because I may be setting myself up for bitter disappointment, but in this episode they mentioned reapplying to NYADA in December 3 times, and not only by Kurt.
I think that the decission to let Kurt fail in 'Goodbye' was made by all the bosses of Glee, Ryan included, but Brad really handled the execution of that plot wrong by neglecting to soften the blow for Kurt and giving us a Finchel lovefest instead. I can hate Ryan with a passion sometimes, but he's not the only one making the decissions and writing Glee, but when he does it's clear he cares for Kurt a lot.

I think his audition if he does one, Kurt will pick a straight role, showing he can play a straight male lead. I loved Not the Boy Next Door, but that just showed Kurt being gay can play a gay performer.

If they had used that in the show, that Kurt had unfortunately stereotyped himself maybe we would have understood better why Kurt didn't get in.
(---)
I hope no-one is angry about The Boy Next Door part because I really loved that performance, it just got me thinking, that yes Kurt did think out of the box, but I do think he did stereotype himself. Carmen would have already picked up on that he was gay, and if he had chosen something that showed he was more than just gay that he can play straight as well.

Don't worry, I actually agree with you on NTBND. It was a great performance, and by singing this gay flamboyant song Kurt took revenge on the people at McKinley High who didn't see his potential in performing. But those people who held him back were not Carmen.
Carmen saw a gay kid singing a gay song, and she could have concluded that this niche Kurt put himself in was all he could do, so he stereotyped and limited himself. That's one of the reasons why I am so angry about the way they 'solved' this whole effemiphobia issue: the way it was done it looks like the WSS directors were right, Kurt indeed is gayer than gay and cannot act 'straight' enough even if he tried (and we all know he could do that just fine for 2 seasons long).

Personally I think that NTBND stereotyping Kurt was not the reason why he didn't get NYADA, but it was his thin resume.
Although, let's be real: Kurt didn't get NYADA because the writers didn't want him to, so that Rachel could be the special snowflake. But it would be nice to get a canon reason for Kurt's rejection, and maybe a new audition in which Kurt has learned and has improved himself even more.

[Ranwing]

A friend of mine just posted some interesting commenatry on her blog and pointed out something that I missed upon first viewing (but became very apparent when seeing it the second time around). The scene in the Lima Bean, where we see Kurt living out what had been his worst nightmare in season 3. Kurt is very clearly struggling to maintain his dignity at a time when those around him see him as the new "Lima Loser". This was a time when Kurt needed Blaine's support the most, especially once Kitty stepped into the scene and started snapping Kurt her condesending complaints (capped off with his boss's order to refill the biscotti jar). Kurt is only able to stand there, humilated and forced to accept Kitty's abuse. Where was Blaine when this was happening? Darting out the door, as if he's afraid that Kitty might see him with Kurt and associate him with the Lima Loser. Like Finn did in season 2, Blaine abandoned Kurt in order to protect his own tenuous hold on his newfound popularity.

It's interesting, but throughout season 3, Blaine's chief fear as Kurt's graduation approached was that he would no longer have a place in Kurt's life. That Kurt would dart off to his exciting new life in NY and silly little Blaine in Lima would not longer fit in with him. But now that Kurt is momentarily stuck until he his able to regain traction on his plans, it's Kurt who no longer fits in Blaine's life. And it's Blaine again who withdraws. When Kurt leaves, it's with a hug only slightly warmer than the one Finn gave Kurt in Born This Way. Blaine didn't even go to see Kurt off at the airport for a private farewell with the young man that he called the love of his life.

I'm firmly at the stage when seperation can only be good for both these characters. As much as I liked Klaine at first, both characters are now clearly chaffing under the confines. Kurt needs to find his own place in the spotlight without also dealing with his spotlight hogging boyfriend, and Blaine needs to find an existance at McKinely as more than Kurt Hummel's boyfriend (something that has always eluded him despite all the leads and solos he gained there). Maybe absence will make the heart grow fonder, or maybe they will find that they function better apart. But they clearly cannot continue as they have up until now. They are in their own way as disfunctional now as Finchel was.

[fantastica]

^ very interesting. now I got why blaine would push kurt out to NY so eagerly: he's so embarrassed of having a Lima loser boyfriend. He doesn't want to be seen w/ him out in the school anymore. He needs to maintain his popularity. this guy is a snob. that's why he's also ashamed of Unique's makeup.

strangely i like snobby blaine. at least he's got one clear personality.

[sahhar]

That's a very, very interesting observation and interpretation Ranwing. Very interesting.

[valkeakuulas]

Very good observation and makes us all think. Didn't Darren in some of these mysterious spoilers say that Blaine was going to start acting out of character. Did he mean just this popularity thing or maybe these are the first subtle signs of him distancing himself from Kurt for real. Could RIB be that intelligent with their writing? Not really sure about that but in any other show I'd agree without a moments hesitation. On the other hand for teenagers image is everything and Blaine being embarrased about Lima loser BF would be realistic, but again this is Glee

BTW that short sentece from Kurt "I know I'm pathetic." was really painful. I can't really remember what other than No, no, no, no you're not or something like that was Blaine's response. Do I have to watch the Kurt scenes again now that this idea is in my head?

[ChrisColferFan1]

I like Klaine much better in Fan Fic than on the show,so I would not mind at all if they breakup and Kurt finds someone new.

[Divalicious]

I would have to rewatch the episode, but when I saw Blaine leave, I thought he was just going to class, and had to leave. Not defending Blaine, because I am in this for Kurt's Happiness, but I don't think Blaine sees Kurt as a Lima Loser. I think he saw him as someone going through a hard time, and is letting himself down. He even said to Kurt that Lima was killing him, and he needed to leave. I do think Blaine is a little snobby, and his reaction to Unique was not exactly supportive, whether it be another spotlight seeker entered in the room or him being uncomfortable with a transgender boy. I do not fall for the "perfection" of Blaine, but I also don't see him other than supportive at this time. He may be a total jerk in episode 4, but he isn't right now. JMHO.

[zuppid]

I like Klaine.They are supportive of each other.It's the only couple which shows this.

[Divalicious]

It was nice to have Kurt back on the screen. Is it me, or is he speaking in a lower tone of voice? Love his voice, any tone he may choose.

First time in a veeerrrry long time I wasn't totally annoyed by Brittney. Her lines were short, random and not a huge focus, just the right amount as far as I am concerned. I may change my mind next episode with a huge focus on her.

Brody is handsome, not my type, but I can appreciate other people's attraction. There is no chemistry that I can see, but that is a subjective thing. The immediate besotted nature of the character is a bit much, but Rachel must have a cheering squad, and he is the only character available. His acting seems adequate, but kind of drags the scene down. His singing is not remarkable in the least, we are back to season 1 where Finn was supposed to be this wonderful singer, suspending disbelief is essential on Glee.

Jake has potential, but I am not a real fan of the bad boy storylines, I hope they can bring something to the story I am interested in. I saw a lot more Sarley than I did Jarley, I like Sam and Marley, but I am told they are going the mentor route between them. His voice is fine, nothing outstanding that I am getting, kind of interchangeable with Blaine's, but I think they will stick with big poppy songs for Blaine, and more soulful ones for Jake.

I liked Marley, some consider her a milquetoast, but I like the shyer nature. We get to see her bloom. Rather than a self-confident in her abilities Rachel, who had well-off, doting parents who could give her every lesson and support, we have a shy girl, raised by a woman who because of her size prefers to remain unnoticed. I didn't detect a lot of confidence, and certainly no obvious money to support her like Rachel had from her Dads. There is a lot of potential. Of course, bringing things back to Kurt I am hoping we finally get that Kurt make over the lunch lady storyline, perhaps for Christmas. He is in fashion now, and Chris' love of lunchladies is well known. Crossing fingers.

Kitty, I just hope they keep her a bitch, instead of making her bipolar that Quinn suffered from. I don't mind softening, because one dimensional characters get very dull, but no true redemption. I am sure they will have a Santana and Kitty smack down. The fact that Kitty seems a bigot will make it interesting for her to interact with a hispanic lesbian.

Kurt looked tired, but I think Chris did that on purpose, to show how Kurt was literally wasting away in Lima, but holding himself together. He looked so gorgeous at the airport and his brief NY scene, the young man finally in his element. Well, the class room outfit with the sheet music was also stunning. The best father and son on network television of course showed the love yet again. That loving someone means supporting them in doing things that might hurt you, but the love is more important than the hurt. Burt, tough, strong father, breaking down in tears, shows that real men aren't afraid to cry, just little boys are.

Nice to know that Brittney and Santana have a scene coming up, where Kurt and Blaine, about to be separated by the hundreds of miles get a nice little hug. After the student body and cheerios join Blaine in a little song. Kurt gets to smile and watch. Missing his lovely singing voice, sigh.

The rest, good that Will is being used as a teacher. Good that Tina is finally being given a personality other than crying and the occasional supportive line. Unique is okay, and I hope they keep her to the amount they have now, because while funny line deliver is fine, I still think Alex is lacking in the acting department. Artie is very good at the dictator director role, and hope to see it continue. Sue had the right amount of snark, but not outright hatred and over the topness in past seasons. Cassandra is refreshing, to have a teacher not kissing Rachel's butt, but I think her ire is mainly now because Rachel voiced the elephant in the room, the alcohol. The looks on all the other students showed they knew of Cassandra's problem, but were smart enough not to voice it. I just hope they don't have Rachel decide to do an intervention, let Cassandra solve her own problem, Rachel's acknowledgement of the alcohol was what made her review her own options. Carmen, you need to review your audition policies, if you take stalkers, and girls whose voices aren't ready-assuming they would practice over the summer. Then you reject someone who sang and danced for you, showing more than the park and bark that Rachel and blondie had. Sam, you have become just a solid, good guy. I hope the show manages to give you your own storyline this year. I didn't care too much for Sam season 2 after he wasn't Kurt's boyfriend, his stories didn't connect with me, didn't miss him when he wasn't in the beginning of season 3, but really grew to appreciate him. He is fairly consistent, a miracle on Glee, a nice guy who isn't boring. The impressions and general nerdiness help. I like Sugar, and her enthusiasm, and think she would work well with Unique. I always kind of wished Sugar and Sam would get together last season, to have the rich girl/poor boy story. I just don't know if Sugar has enough substance to deserve such a nice boyfriend.

That is what comes to mind right now.

[BlueJazz]

@ranwing, thanks for the interesting post. I'm not surprised that Blaine didn't defend kurt when he was insulted because since when he did that? Remember Lima bean encounter with Seb in 'michael'? However, i am not bothered by that. Maybe he sucks at confrontation or maybe he was rushing to class. I don't think he's ashamed of his bf but it's not a good response after the 'the love of his life ' was insulted, either. Also, i fully agree that a break up for klaine is quite necessary at this point.

Tbh, i'd rather kurt learns how to defend himself instead of waiting for someone else to do it for him.

[Kurt Hummel]

I like Klaine.They are supportive of each other.It's the only couple which shows this.

I agree. I've loved and shipped Klaine ever since they sang "Baby, It's Cold Outside" in S2.

[fantastica]

They cut the scene of Kurt with his multi dollars suitcases in the airport.

no, it's in there. that's him walking away from the car after talking to his dad. the only thing is they showed the back of his head, not his whole body, so his multi-thousand dollar suitcases didn't end up on the screen. In fact, you don't even know he has luggage at all. we know he is holding them because we saw the Papp's photos.

[ColferInspired]

I know I am going to be the minority here, but I actually liked this episode.

I liked it too, and if you look at the poll I think it's not a real minority opinion.

And I felt as Ryan wrote this that he put more care and love into the Kurt and Burt scene than any of the other scenes in the episode. It was perfect, it was beautiful.

Brad likes to torture Kurt and stretch it out. The scenes weren't that painful, because they weren't extended, they were short, and you felt Kurt did not belong in Lima.
(---)
I do think Ryan is trying to fix the mess Brad made, and we will eventually see Kurt get into Nyada.
(---)
I do think the spin off, Ryan still wants it to happen, but with Kurt and Rachel.

Keck said Vogue is a detour, maybe that is what it is.
(---)
I only want Ryan writing for Kurt, I don't trust Brad.

I think you're right here. Ryan has always loved Kurt, and though he has written him getting failure and hurt for storylines' sake (like in 'Wheels','Theatricality', 'I am Unicorn') he has always made sure that the audience knew that Kurt was mistreated and that he was not alone. Now, in 'The New Rachel' he showed a down and getting ridiculed/humiliated Kurt, but although I didn't like the Kitty/Sue scene, Kurt still held himself upright and the scenes were brief, only to show Kurt's rightfully depressed state, and after getting no POV from Kurt in 'Goodbye' I'm glad they showed his feelings in 'The New Rachel', even when they weren't good feelings.

And I really fear getting my hopes up, because I may be setting myself up for bitter disappointment, but in this episode they mentioned reapplying to NYADA in December 3 times, and not only by Kurt.
I think that the decission to let Kurt fail in 'Goodbye' was made by all the bosses of Glee, Ryan included, but Brad really handled the execution of that plot wrong by neglecting to soften the blow for Kurt and giving us a Finchel lovefest instead. I can hate Ryan with a passion sometimes, but he's not the only one making the decissions and writing Glee, but when he does it's clear he cares for Kurt a lot.

I think his audition if he does one, Kurt will pick a straight role, showing he can play a straight male lead. I loved Not the Boy Next Door, but that just showed Kurt being gay can play a gay performer.

If they had used that in the show, that Kurt had unfortunately stereotyped himself maybe we would have understood better why Kurt didn't get in.
(---)
I hope no-one is angry about The Boy Next Door part because I really loved that performance, it just got me thinking, that yes Kurt did think out of the box, but I do think he did stereotype himself. Carmen would have already picked up on that he was gay, and if he had chosen something that showed he was more than just gay that he can play straight as well.

Don't worry, I actually agree with you on NTBND. It was a great performance, and by singing this gay flamboyant song Kurt took revenge on the people at McKinley High who didn't see his potential in performing. But those people who held him back were not Carmen.
Carmen saw a gay kid singing a gay song, and she could have concluded that this niche Kurt put himself in was all he could do, so he stereotyped and limited himself. That's one of the reasons why I am so angry about the way they 'solved' this whole effemiphobia issue: the way it was done it looks like the WSS directors were right, Kurt indeed is gayer than gay and cannot act 'straight' enough even if he tried (and we all know he could do that just fine for 2 seasons long).

Personally I think that NTBND stereotyping Kurt was not the reason why he didn't get NYADA, but it was his thin resume.
Although, let's be real: Kurt didn't get NYADA because the writers didn't want him to, so that Rachel could be the special snowflake. But it would be nice to get a canon reason for Kurt's rejection, and maybe a new audition in which Kurt has learned and has improved himself even more.

I also agree with the application should have had more on it and about the writers.

But if this is leading up to him getting in with an amazing audition in front of Carmen showing her like Kurt said to Finn in "Laryingitis" that he isn't a box there is more than four sides to him, then think of what they could come up with as an audition piece.

And it would be good for Chris's career to show that he can play Kurt playing straight performing a straight male song without being butch like he did for "Pink Houses".

It would definitely be talked about.

We saw a bit of it with "The Music of The Night", but I'm think something that you wouldn't likely think Kurt would do.

Ranwing suggested some choses in the spoiler thread, and those are the sort of things I would have suggested if I had thought of them as well.

[zuppid]

I like Klaine.They are supportive of each other.It's the only couple which shows this.

I agree. I've loved and shipped Klaine ever since they sang "Baby, It's Cold Outside" in S2.

Ooooh.I thought I was the only one on this forum!


I agree with the other Kurtsies in there!
They repeated too often that Kurt will re-apply to the NYADA.

I hope he will not enjoy TOO much the new job :D but I think he loves perfoming too much to give up on that

[Delight]

So, some thoughts on the new characters they've decided to cram into Glee this season:

Cassandra July:

From the writing so far, I'm guessing that dance teacher is mean to Rachel because she saw Rachel's potential and wanted to either ignite it with tough love, or crush it because of bitter jealousy. I hope that it's neither (because that would be an original idea).

Actually, after watching the episode, I find that Cassandra's hostility towards Rachel hadn't been unprovoked. Rachel rolled her eyes at what Cassandra said to another student, more or less called her out as a drunk in public and challenged her with her 'I'll be the best' declaration.

I like that the writers have decided to add more depth to Cassandra (there's some gooey-ness underneath that hard exterior). I have no desire to see another variant of Sue Sylvester on Glee.

Marley:

Marley is nice, and that's probably all I can say about this character right now.

Those mother/daughter scenes came across as a bit too calculated for me. It's only the first episode, so I still have good will towards this Marley character; but I have a feeling that she would disappoint once they feature her too much and it becomes obvious that she really isn't that interesting a character.

Not to say that 'nice' TV characters can't be interesting, but they're often boring (e.g. Ned Flanders in the Simpsons).

Rachel came across as more cardboard-ish and 'less real' when compared to Marley, but I find Rachel to be a more interesting and funny character.

Of course, I'm more than willing to be proven wrong. It's too soon to tell whether this character would take in the long run.

Jake Puckeman:

His 'angry outburst' on stage doesn't feel natural to me. Also, not all that impressed with his singing.

Kitty:

Oh, there's no avoiding hating this character for her 'mean girl' attitude towards Kurt. Why do I get the feeling that her bitchiness had been cranked way, way up so that most of the audience would actually find Santana a lot more like-able in comparison?

Brody:

Eye candy and personal cheerleader of one Miss Rachel Berry. That's his main function on the show right now. Don't have much opinion about this character, good or bad.

[valkeakuulas]

Jim's back and he's sort of OK with Glee...

[fantastica]

takes a lot of brain power to force ourselves not to think in order to tolerate glee. same here.

[Sponsored content]