Re: General Glee Discussion Thread--Part 1

[Jellyrolls]

No! Don't go there! Don't post that in writing! Don't give the Glee writers any ideas!

Don't ruin my Kadam for me! The writers are going to tht soon enough on their own.

I'll ban you all!

[brisallie]

No! Don't go there! Don't post that in writing! Don't give the Glee writers any ideas!

Don't ruin my Kadam for me! The writers are going to tht soon enough on their own.

I'll ban you all!

Karen please calm! I'm sure the girls were kidding with all that stuff. Besides, I think a little imagination it doesnt hurt, if writers don't read those things, its ok.

[fantastica]

Im not kidding please ban me.

[Jellyrolls]

No! Don't go there! Don't post that in writing! Don't give the Glee writers any ideas!

Don't ruin my Kadam for me! The writers are going to tht soon enough on their own.

I'll ban you all!

Karen please calm! I'm sure the girls were kidding with all that stuff. Besides, I think a little imagination it doesnt hurt, if writers don't read those things, its ok.

I was being sarcastic.

[Glorfindel]

I agree to not give them any ideas, lol.
It wouldn't even be the most ludicrous storyline they have ever done.

[MoviesAreLife]

Oh NO! I think I had a dream about this last night!

[sheny]

[MoviesAreLife]

Glee has its share of problems, but it has done some good also.

[Glorfindel]

This is interesting. Someone over on p_f pointed it out.
It's an article that appeared before season 4 started in New Zealand. This person comments on her expectations for season 4 of Glee, and I think it's spot on (I bolded what I like) :

Guest post: Not excited for Glee S4
Last updated 08:30 19/09/2012

Today's guest post is written by Jess Etheridge, journalist for the North Shore Times, previous OTB contributor, and a damn fine woman (all things considered). Since she's also a reformed Glee fan, I've invited her to share a few thoughts on the fourth season, starting tonight, 7.30 on Four, as part of their Fast Four campaign. Thanks for helping out, Jess! - Chris

Eep! I'm writing for On the Box! Which is a total honour but also terrifying at the same time. Chris has run away overseas (I believe Glee's imminent return has chased him away!) so I'm here to give you my take on the musical tween show. Be kind, trolls!

20120919(Warning: this post contains spoilers for the fourth season of Glee.)

First, I have a confession to make (though it's not really a "confession" when I've been blasting it on Twitter for months): I'm no longer a fan of Glee. Gasp! "But you wrote about it on Chris' blog previously & you loved it, didn't you?!" you may say.

Well, sorta.

See the one thing I didn't mention at the time was by the end of season two I'd already had enough of the lack of continuity, equality and great storylines for each character, not to mention the fact a lot of the "jokes" are based on stereotypes.

It's not all about Will's crazy mash-ups!

So I switched off. After Dianna Agron's character Quinn (probably my favourite actor/character from the show) was in a car crash I switched off mentally from the show. I watched a couple more episodes, I quite liked the friendship that developed between Quinn and Artie but that was about it for me. Not to mention Rachel and Finn's wedding made me heave.

I don't know what happened at the end of last season and I don't care anymore. This is how a group of writers turns a show with a lot of potential into a joke.

What do I think is going to happen in season four? Well thanks to the Internet, we know mostly how the first episode will go: Rachel and Kurt (eventually) move to New York City and the show is going to become a strange show-within-a-show type setup. Around the beginning of the US summer holidays many of the cast members were quoted in several stories as saying writer Ryan Murphy's idea for the next season was "ground-breaking". The show-within-a-show seems to be what they were referring to. There were calls across the internet for a Rachel and Kurt spinoff show, which would've been fabulous but Murphy dismissed any spinoff plans.

You've got the graduated Lima High glee kids (Finn, Puck, Santana etc) trying to figure out their futures and then a new crop of kids auditioning for New Directions, and I assume the latest winner of The Glee Project will pop up somewhere along the way.

What should be interesting this season: Sarah Jessica Parker and Kate Hudson. It's a big deal to have those two sign on to be recurring characters. I've read SJP will be Kurt's boss after he gets an internship at Vogue. This may actually be the only great storyline on the show as Kurt will be working in a cool environment and will be away from any romantic interest (hopefully). Believe it or not, but some of the best stories are about self-development and career rather than "oh I love THIS person and will spend ALL OF THE TIME with them".

Alas, Glee has run its course. It has had some great moments (Don't Rain on My Parade, sung by Lea Michele in season one, remains my favourite moment of the entire series) and has launched the careers of several members of the cast, particularly Chris Colfer. He's published a children's storybook (which was on the New York Times bestsellers list), written, directed and starred in his first feature film which was incredibly well received by critics, and is basically BFFs with everyone in Hollywood.

But I just feel sad for the show and its crew. It's no longer unique with TV show Smash also starting in New Zealand and receiving rave reviews for its first season in the States. Glee deserves a good send-off though. I've spent at least three years of my life with it and it only feels fitting that if (hopefully) this is the last season, it gets it right. I'll give the first episode of this season a go but I think that's it, for me.

source

[Jellyrolls]

I just happened to find this article, and thought it was interesting:

So far, "Glee" season 4 is a mess. For several seasons, the cast has grown to the point where the show has become disjointed. There are too many characters, and there is not enough screen time to accommodate everyone.

At some point, this show is going to have to make some serious cuts. Which characters need to go? And which characters are on the fence?

Characters Who Need to Go

Wade Adams/Unique (Alex Newell)

Alex came in fourth on "The Glee Project," but he's gotten way more screen time than that season's co-winner Damian McGinty (who has been all but written out).

During his run on "Glee Project," Alex didn't show a lot of versatility, and was consistently unable to portray characters outside his comfort zone.

His saving grace is that he brings down the house when he performs in drag, but beyond that, he's a one-trick pony.

Marley Rose (Melissa Benoist)

Marley is this season's Lauren Zizes (Ashley Fink), consistently panned by the critics and fans, yet the writers insist on shoving her down our throats.

Marley is a beta version of high-school Rachel Berry (Lea Michele), whiny, needy, and insecure, but lacking in Rachel's star power or charisma. Not only does Marley stink up the screen every time, but her appearance on the show takes valuable screen time away from long-suffering cast members like Jenna Ushkowitz and Kevin McHale.

Noah Puckerman (Mark Salling)

One of Puck's main purposes on the show was to be a probable end game match for Quinn (Dianna Agron). Yet compared to couples like Rachel and Finn (Cory Monteith), and Kurt (Chris Colfer) and Blaine (Darren Criss), Quinn and Puck never seemed to generate that level of rooting interest with the fans.

The writers are clearly overreaching in their attempts to keep post-graduate Puck on the show. We're not particularly invested in his age-inappropriate relationship with Kitty (Becca Tobin). As for Jake (Jacob Artist), he's an interesting enough character on his own, without having to be Puck's brother.

Will Schuester (Matthew Morrison)

Considering how much I loved "Glee" season 1, I feel like a bit of a traitor for putting Mr. Schue in this category. However, ever since Will turned down April Rhodes' (Kristin Chenoweth) future Tony Award-winning musical, his character somehow became stuck.

Will doesn't seem to have any friends his own age, and he seems to be living vicariously through his students.

And this season, Mr. Schue's character became superfluous when Finn took over the glee club. From the sweater vests, to the cardigans, to kissing Emma (Jayma Mays), Finn has become a mini-Will.

On The Fence

Sue Sylvester (Jane Lynch)

We know that the writers are not going to cut Sue. After all, Jane won an Emmy for her iconic role as the villainous Cheerios coach.

However, Sue's character has become repetitive. Most of the time, she's a violent sociopath hellbent on destroying the glee club. Then, usually around Christmas or the season finales, she suddenly morphs into soft vulnerable Sue. She vacillates between Grinch Sue and Reformed Scrooge Sue with no middle ground.

The whole Mean Sue vs. Nice Sue schtick is getting old. Sue has become a two-dimensional, two-trick pony.

Quinn Fabray (Dianna Agron)

For the first three seasons, the writers failed to give her a story line that didn't portray her as a shrill vindictive harpie. Dianna is a talented actress, but there's only so much she can do with the material that they give her.

Part of me just wants the writers to put her out of her misery by letting her leave with dignity. However, I'd be on board with keeping Quinn if they reunite her with Sam (Chord Overstreet) or explore a relationship with Santana (Naya Rivera).

Ryder Lynn (Blake Jenner)

I almost like this guy. Ryder is clean-cut and earnest. And his academic struggles make him a sympathetic character.

Still, he loses a few points for being a too similar to Sam (Chord Overstreet) and for his unrequited crush on sad sack Marley. Why not have him date Tina Cohen-Chang (Jenna Ushkowitz) instead? He could help her get over her sudden obsession with gay Blaine.

Kitty Wilde (Becca Tobin)

Like Jake, fans don't seem to be digging the "Meow Mix" either. So far, she hasn't shown herself beyond being a beta version of Quinn (Dianna Agron). Sure, she's had some funny one-liners, but the snark is so much funnier when it comes out of Becky Jackson's (Lauren Potter) mouth.

On the other hand, given that Sue's character has grown stale this season, it might be worth keeping Kitty around in order to give the show a fresh villain.

Mercedes Jones (Amber Riley)

I'm on the fence about this one. On the one hand, I just don't see how a post-graduate Mercedes could continue to be relevant on the show. Her character belongs in LA, not New York. Unlike Rachel and Kurt, Mercedes wants to be a recording artist, not a Broadway star.

On the other hand, I'd like her to stick around for awhile in the hopes that she and Sam will be an end game couple.

Sam Evans (Chord Overstreet)

Sam is one of the more realistic and multifaceted characters on the show. In seasons 2 and 3, he showed that he was more than just a pretty face and rock hard abs.

However, season 4 Sam has become grating. Ever since he starting dating Brittany (Heather Morris), he has become a walking blond punchline.

I'd be on board with keeping Sam if they drop the Brittany story line and reunite him with either Quinn or Mercedes (Amber Riley).

Source

[brisallie]

This article is quite interesting, and probably some viewers are agree with it. Personally Marley is my less favorite from the newbies, she's so bland to me. And I didn't know that Lauren wasn't really accepted by critics and fans, I thought she was slightly loved. I mean, I read nice comments when she came back in Sadie Hawkings episode.

[Glorfindel]

I think Lauren was liked as a character with Puck, but not as a dancer and performer within ND.
And tbh: she was standing out in a negative way in the group numbers, and not just because she is not a size 2. She just doesn't have a good stage presence.

[Jellyrolls]

I was never a fan of Lauren. I just didn't like the character. And remember that she was brought in to replace Kurt, and she definitely is not Kurt

Also, yesterday as Oliver's birthday, so if you like him on facebook, make sure you wish him a happy birthday. He posted thanking everyone for the birthday wishes (let's see what the Blarren/Klainers do to turn this on around on him) .

[brisallie]

Got it. What people liked was the Puck-Lauren dynamic. And I remember once it was commented here or somewhere else, how Mercedes/Amber being also a overweight girl, dances graciously.

@Jelly, I have FB so thanks for telling us that it was Oliver's b-day. Wondering if he turns 30? lol

[Divalicious]

I liked the Puck-Lauren dynamic. I had never been a big Puck fan, but when he dated Lauren, he was the bad ass he always wanted to be, the man he always said people were teaching him to be. Most popular teen boys would not be caught dead dating a big girl. Puck didn't see a big girl, he wasn't ignorant of the fact, he just saw she was more of a badass than he was, and he was attracted to that. So I liked he was interested in Lauren because she was strong, the rest was just the wrapping. A lot of the guys on this show want to fix problems, Lauren didn't have any, she didn't give a crap about anyone's opinion. He showed the big young ladies out there that people who matter will look beyond the body, and see the personality within. That owning who you are is a strength, and keeps people from using it against you. A good message.

Then they regressed Lauren to being a loser this year, thanks a lot, Glee.

[MoviesAreLife]

Lauren irritated the crap out of me, whereas I do like Marley (but I wish she'd grow a backbone). LOL! Don't tar and feather me, please!

[ColferGirl]

I liked Lauren for the exact reasons Divalicious listed. I am one of those big girls like Lauren, have been my whole life. Struggled with it, been hurt by others over it and felt defined by it. I loved seeing a big girl on my tv screen who could get the "hot, popular" guy at school to fall in love with her, and see beyond her body to who she was inside - but most importantly, a big girl who didn't let her weight define and hurt her, like I've let mine. I don't often see people that look like me on tv (not in prominent roles), and especially not in circumstances like that, so it was nice. Lauren may have been too headstrong/bitchy/irritating for some, but it was really refreshing for me to see a character like that.

[arina]

I kinda liked Lauren at first when she was there to serve Puck’s storyline. But then she was getting too much screentime (more than originál characters like Tina) for my liking. I don't like when new minor characters starts took away too much from others so she started to got my on my nerves.

I don’t like Marley, she is too sugary and bland for my liking, I don’t find anything about her personality interesting, I think that even if she was the lead girl in the beginning of Glee she wouldn’t have half of the success Rachel had. Rachel was so untypical lead girl and I loved that about her(even if she was someetimes irritating as hell – but she had personality and great charisma). I really miss those times when Glee was unique show with unique characters.
Actually I have to admit Unique is probably my favorite newbie because she at least fits under the term underdogs Glee was supposed to be about… And Alex is charismatic performer.
All these abs and boring Jarley that we can see on every other show don’t impress me.

I am torn about the old characters, I love those people and miss them but I can see that many of their appearances on the show are pointless and don’t make much sense.

[BlueJazz]

This is interesting. Someone over on p_f pointed it out.
It's an article that appeared before season 4 started in New Zealand. This person comments on her expectations for season 4 of Glee, and I think it's spot on (I bolded what I like) :

Guest post: Not excited for Glee S4
Last updated 08:30 19/09/2012

Today's guest post is written by Jess Etheridge, journalist for the North Shore Times, previous OTB contributor, and a damn fine woman (all things considered). Since she's also a reformed Glee fan, I've invited her to share a few thoughts on the fourth season, starting tonight, 7.30 on Four, as part of their Fast Four campaign. Thanks for helping out, Jess! - Chris

Eep! I'm writing for On the Box! Which is a total honour but also terrifying at the same time. Chris has run away overseas (I believe Glee's imminent return has chased him away!) so I'm here to give you my take on the musical tween show. Be kind, trolls!

20120919(Warning: this post contains spoilers for the fourth season of Glee.)

First, I have a confession to make (though it's not really a "confession" when I've been blasting it on Twitter for months): I'm no longer a fan of Glee. Gasp! "But you wrote about it on Chris' blog previously & you loved it, didn't you?!" you may say.

Well, sorta.

See the one thing I didn't mention at the time was by the end of season two I'd already had enough of the lack of continuity, equality and great storylines for each character, not to mention the fact a lot of the "jokes" are based on stereotypes.

It's not all about Will's crazy mash-ups!

So I switched off. After Dianna Agron's character Quinn (probably my favourite actor/character from the show) was in a car crash I switched off mentally from the show. I watched a couple more episodes, I quite liked the friendship that developed between Quinn and Artie but that was about it for me. Not to mention Rachel and Finn's wedding made me heave.

I don't know what happened at the end of last season and I don't care anymore. This is how a group of writers turns a show with a lot of potential into a joke.

What do I think is going to happen in season four? Well thanks to the Internet, we know mostly how the first episode will go: Rachel and Kurt (eventually) move to New York City and the show is going to become a strange show-within-a-show type setup. Around the beginning of the US summer holidays many of the cast members were quoted in several stories as saying writer Ryan Murphy's idea for the next season was "ground-breaking". The show-within-a-show seems to be what they were referring to. There were calls across the internet for a Rachel and Kurt spinoff show, which would've been fabulous but Murphy dismissed any spinoff plans.

You've got the graduated Lima High glee kids (Finn, Puck, Santana etc) trying to figure out their futures and then a new crop of kids auditioning for New Directions, and I assume the latest winner of The Glee Project will pop up somewhere along the way.

What should be interesting this season: Sarah Jessica Parker and Kate Hudson. It's a big deal to have those two sign on to be recurring characters. I've read SJP will be Kurt's boss after he gets an internship at Vogue. This may actually be the only great storyline on the show as Kurt will be working in a cool environment and will be away from any romantic interest (hopefully). Believe it or not, but some of the best stories are about self-development and career rather than "oh I love THIS person and will spend ALL OF THE TIME with them".

Alas, Glee has run its course. It has had some great moments (Don't Rain on My Parade, sung by Lea Michele in season one, remains my favourite moment of the entire series) and has launched the careers of several members of the cast, particularly Chris Colfer. He's published a children's storybook (which was on the New York Times bestsellers list), written, directed and starred in his first feature film which was incredibly well received by critics, and is basically BFFs with everyone in Hollywood.

But I just feel sad for the show and its crew. It's no longer unique with TV show Smash also starting in New Zealand and receiving rave reviews for its first season in the States. Glee deserves a good send-off though. I've spent at least three years of my life with it and it only feels fitting that if (hopefully) this is the last season, it gets it right. I'll give the first episode of this season a go but I think that's it, for me.

source

Great article! Bravo

@Karen, I think you forgot to post the source for the article you posted.

[Jellyrolls]

Hmm. I thought I posted the source (I remember entering the link and typing in source). I'll see if I an find it again.

ETA: Here's the Source

[MoviesAreLife]

Oh, I have no doubt that she might've served as a role model for bigger girls (as did Mercedes). But her attitude just drove me nuts, and I hate how she was Kurt's "replacement" in the choir room! It was a little...heartbreaking seeing his "spot" in that family being taken over by another. Mostly, it irritated me how she seemed to scowl all the time, then again, that type of attitude irks me with almost all characters. And why was she in a Glee club if she couldn't sing or dance and thought that the whole thing was "lame"?

I do think Marley is a "sad sack" and a pushover at times, and I really wish they'd make her grow a spine...still, I think she is adorable and she (and Ryder) are probably my favorite newbies. I like it when they make her socially awkward (like screaming Jake's name when she wanted to ask him to the Sadie Hawkins dance) and I think it's a cute quirk. Arina, I am total opposite of you when it comes to characters I enjoy. I remember you saying somewhere that the more edgy, flawed characters are interesting to you. And, yes, they are interesting.... but I find the nicer characters, the "good guys" to be very endearing. I've always had a thing for the nice ones. In fact, season one Kurt and Carson have stretched my abilities to like a less than pleasant character and corrected me on my black and white thinking. Mostly because, even under all of that snark, I see two kids with hearts of gold, especially with Kurt...and it's so nice to see him blossom into the mature young man I knew was there all along. I just have a thing for niceness.

Also, I can relate to Marley, being a shy, socially awkward "nice girl" and wallflower almost my whole life. This is still something I'm trying to overcome. I can only seem to come out of my shell through the written word (emails, message boards, stories, papers) but in person, I am a...huge wimp. A sad sack and pushover, just like her. I have so many awful real life situations my lack of a spine has gotten me into!

[fantastica]

haha, i see what you mean, and in a way i am also like that, but on my screen i don't want to see someone just like me. it makes me cringe. i want to see someone who is not like me, so i can be more like her.

in terms of weight, I think it's mostly biological (partially genetic). that has nothing to do w/ personalities. big people can be awesomely sweet or awfully nasty. they are not related.

[MoviesAreLife]

I see what you mean. I just think that, if fellow doormats see an introverted bully victim grow a spine, then it will inspire them to grow one as well.

I agree! I like Mercedes...I think she's beautiful, sweet (sometimes) and talented as hell. I cannot stand Santana 95 percent of the time, no matter what she looks like...same thing with Quinn. Awful behavoir is not masked by a pretty face for me (sorry, oversensitve former bully victim). One of my favorite Lauren moments is when she took Santana down a peg, and another one is when she said "I look like a lemon pie..." in the cutest little tone of voice I've ever heard from her (this was when Kurt and the girls were shopping for prom dresses in season two).

[fantastica]

glee is a "comedy" in the sense that the comedy results from insults mostly. that means in order to generate jokes many characters have to be mean and bitchy so they can throw "jokes" around. this is the one thing I really about glee. to me there's nothing funny about somebody's weight, looks, ethnicity or anything else about them that they cannot control.

[MoviesAreLife]

I agree. I don't think the insult comics are funny at all. That's why I prefer Kurt now over his bratty, season one self. I feel he has matured beyond that petty stuff. He only saves his snark now for when he truly needs it.

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