Re: Kurt Hummel Spoiler Thread - part 10

[glimmerle]

They changed Adam's storyline? Oh no.

The only official thing I ever read about any changes in Adam's storyline is Oliver's Billboard interview, where he told that Adam initially was more aggressively flirty and was changed into more of a polite, cordial character. Which I would actually consider a good thing, since it makes me assume he's not a mere Sebastian 2.0 roadblock for Klaine that's ment to be dislikeable but someone the writers want the audience to be fond of.

[Divalicious]

I am also hoping that Adam lays it on the line in ep 15, of what he is wanting with Kurt. Something exclusive and perhaps with a future. So Kurt takes some time to contrast the two guys, one still a boy who lives in the moment (cheating after a brief separation and crushing on a cute guy, also because he is near when Kurt is far away) and one quite the young man who is comfortable with himself. Said man also elevates Kurt without worshipping him, and has admiration for his talent.

It would diminish Kurt's depth of emotions to have him walk away so easily, especially after sleeping with Blaine. It will give more impact to him choosing to explore life with Adam.

Plus it could lead to my wish that the cliffhanger will be Adam taking Kurt to England for the summer (to stay in the family castle) just as Blaine arrives in NY.

Of course, this being Blee, Adam will be friend zoned and he will fall for Blaine when he arrives in NY! we have to keep chemistryless after all. Sigh.

[Buenos]

I think the fact that Adam is not in Episdoe 17 indicates they are going to take their time in telling the story.
Kurt is not Rachel , he gets a minor SL so that is why I'm not completely pessimistic yet .

Oliver's interview was not a direct spoiler of Episode 15 but he did say that "Adam likes Kurt a lot" and that "Kurt is torn between Blaine and Adam" and that hasn't come across YET onscreen so that is probably going to be established in Episode 15. That is way too much to base simply on OLiver's head canon (as the Blaine and Klainers claim) if he had already filmed Ep 15 ( which he had ) prior to the interview.

He would have looked foolish saying Kurt was torn if Kurt was going to dump his ass in Episode 15. Plus in the interview he said for Kurt Adam could be what he needs for the next few months of his life. Once again, taking into account an actor building up his character (which every actor does but apparently only OLiver gets vilified and bashed for) its seems too much of a stretch for Oliver to say any of this if Episode 15 was closing the door on his character.

I hope I'm right but of course this is Glee.

The fact that Regionals doesn't occur until at least Episode 18 has some speculating that this season is not going to end the school year of McKinley but that instead they will extend out to season five , at least part of it. I have mixed feelings for this but as long as Kurt gets his owon SL's I'll wait and and see.

[arina]

Off topic But I've just remember wasn't Rachel supposed to get some enemy in the school? Or was I just imagining that spoiler?

[Glorfindel]

^Yes, there were some spoilers that said there would be a rival for her in dancing class, but I think they changed that more to Cassandra July herself.
There was a black swan ballerina on screen for a few seconds during the Winter Showcase, who many thought was the supposed rival, but nothing came from that.

I would love for Rachel to have another female singer as a rival, instead of always pitting her against Kurt, who should not be a rival anymore.
Or maybe some struggles for Rachel during acting class, as she is not a good actress in canon.

[ColferGirl]

I'm with @Ranwing: if Kadam get together in 4x15 I don't mind Adam not being shown for 2 episodes, just like Brody is not in every episode (although I of course would prefer more Adam on my screen, but this is Glee and we can't have nice things).

I think 4x16 and 4x17 don't have a Kurt storyline, and he will only be the best gay and roommate in those episodes.
So let's hope that 4x18 will be his traditional big episode.

About Brody....he actually has been in every episode though. Every single episode Rachel's been in, so has he - the only exception is the Christmas episode. Of course Rachel is the main character so her love interest gets more prominence than Kurt's....(to my sadness ) but I just wanted to point out that Brody has absolutely been in every episode. His intro in 4x01, helping with the Britney song in 4x02, he and Rachel dueted and nearly kissed in 4x03, he was there to duet again at Callbacks with Rachel in 4x04, in 4x06 he slept with Cassandra and danced with her, in 4x08 he spent Thanksgiving with Rachel and had scenes with her, in 4x09 he encouraged her and they kissed and got together, in 4x11 is when he's asked to move in, 4x12 he has the naked scene and encourages her to go topless, 4x13 he supports Rachel in Midnight Madness, 4x14 we see him at the end and learn he's a gigolo. Brody's actually been everywhere this season.

Which is why Kurt and his new love interest storyline getting so sidelined in comparison makes me really sad....even just one scene an episode, to develop them piece by piece, would have been lovely. Just one scene. But instead, they keep stopping and starting Kurt's storyline, or developing it completely off screen. Would it have killed the writers to give us a glimpse of their first date? Even just as part of a montage in an end-of-episode number? Even Brittany and Sam as a couple are getting a huge amount of songs and development in comparison to Kurt and Adam, and Kurt was a clear main character in S2 and S3. But lately it feels like the writers barely care about Kurt and his story (or at least about it developing naturally and continuously)....I'm clutching to episode 18 desperately right now, and hoping 19 or 20 might focus on him too. Until 4x22 rolls around, there's always hope.

The fact that Regionals doesn't occur until at least Episode 18 has some speculating that this season is not going to end the school year of McKinley but that instead they will extend out to season five , at least part of it. I have mixed feelings for this but as long as Kurt gets his owon SL's I'll wait and and see.

In season 1, Regionals was the season finale, and the Glee writers offered no explanation about why Regionals was suddenly months earlier in season 2. I think they may do something similarly in this season. I don't think Regionals will be the finale (graduation will), but it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if they ignored logical timelines - they already have, waiting this long - and will simply have Regionals be near graduation this year. And no Nationals, since they'll lose Regionals. If the writers wanted to split school years into two seasons, they should have done that back in season 3 with the old cast - if they do it now, they are idiots, plain and simple, and will tick off a ton of the fans who loved the older cast, myself included, because why couldn't they split the years when we had the cast that mattered. I also can't imagine them letting go of their favored holiday episodes next season, since they won't be able to do Christmas or Valentine's if they're splitting this school year in half (worse than that, not even half - they'd been lengthening only the last two, three months of the year? Doesn't make sense). And the writing will get really messy if they try and shoehorn the last few months of this year into the beginning of S5, and then try and time jump and make the timeline match logically to the real world again for the rest of the season?

But who knows. You're right, we'll have to wait and see. But S1's finale being Regionals makes me think the writers are perfectly fine with ending the school year again around there, especially if they want to parallel/mirror the S1 cast's journey with the new kids.

[Buenos]

[quote="ColferGirl"]

Which is why Kurt and his new love interest storyline getting so sidelined in comparison makes me really sad....even just one scene an episode, to develop them piece by piece, would have been lovely. Just one scene. But instead, they keep stopping and starting Kurt's storyline, or developing it completely off screen. Would it have killed the writers to give us a glimpse of their first date? Even just as part of a montage in an end-of-episode number? Even Brittany and Sam as a couple are getting a huge amount of songs and development in comparison to Kurt and Adam, and Kurt was a clear main character in S2 and S3. But lately it feels like the writers barely care about Kurt and his story (or at least about it developing naturally and continuously)....I'm clutching to episode 18 desperately right now, and hoping 19 or 20 might focus on him too. Until 4x22 rolls around, there's always hope.

I am usually an optimist but there is such a dearth of SL spoilers for Kurt at the moment it is a bit disheartening. I realize Chris Colfer is laughing all the way to the bank (collect paycheck, not have to do much) but still...

Side note: I agree while extending the school year doesn't sound reasonable, however, the only reason they might do the stupid time delay is if they are really that desperate to have the new kids "stick" and feel they need more than one complete season to prop them up, even if it causes other inconveniences such as favorite holidays shown on Glee.

[glimmerle]

The fact that Regionals doesn't occur until at least Episode 18 has some speculating that this season is not going to end the school year of McKinley but that instead they will extend out to season five , at least part of it.

I thought about that as well. This way they'd avoid the massive looming problem of each and every original/season 2 cast member finally graduating from McKinley for another year and have more time to explore the storylines of their innumerable characters. They are already shooting episode 17 right now, so there are only five episodes left and so far nothing about regionals, Blaine's college application, senior prom, graduation, Finn doing something about his future, Kadam development and maybe NYADA has a summer showcase, too? What was the point of ND worming their way back into regionals, only to let them lose in the end? What was the point of introducing Adam and his NYADA show choir, when he'll be graduating from NYADA before we even get to know him or see the Apples again? What about Burt's cancer? What about the character played by Jessica Sanchez, that's still waiting to be introduced? I don't even know what's going on with all the newbies. There are so many open ends this season because they barely get around to scratch the surface of every storyline. Still they bring in even more storylines (like Rachel's pregnancy scare) instead of working on bringing closure to the ones they already have. Those last five episodes will be incredibly rushed and overstuffed if they actually want to stay true to their timeline.

[Glorfindel]

You're right, Erin, about Brody. I just forgot he was in every episode , as he barely registers in my mind, even when he's shirtless.


It is very frustrating that Kurt gets so short shrifted this season. In songs, in storylines, in conversations, in POV, especially in comparison with other characters who go through similar situations, like Rachel and Blaine.
It seems RIB deliberately don't want to use their best assets. Chris, Lea, Cory, Kevin, Matt, Jayma, Jane: they are wasting them. Instead we have to watch those horribly boring noobs, Bram, Blam and Blina. (I'm afraid Tina has been ruined for me)
It's like a chef cook serving the poor dishes to his guests, having to overcook the withered vegetables and pour spicy sauces over the leathery meat to hide the poor taste, while keeping the juicy and delicious food in the fridge.

And I suspect that Kurt is the one who gets the short end of the stick the most because he has a direct replacement they desperately want to push to become as successful as Kurt is: Blaine.
It's no coincedence that Blaine acts 'gayer' than he used to and gets the same recycled storylines that Kurt got, only without the barbs and thorns attached to them.


They took a big gamble by putting their most popular characters on the backburner in order to get the newbies and the last year's ND leftovers in the choir room to pop this season, and it failed. But I expected they would have seen the error of their ways by now, and correct it, but it seems they haven't.

[Jellyrolls]

Don't forget we have Blue coming up too.

[glimmerle]

Which is why Kurt and his new love interest storyline getting so sidelined in comparison makes me really sad....even just one scene an episode, to develop them piece by piece, would have been lovely. Just one scene. But instead, they keep stopping and starting Kurt's storyline, or developing it completely off screen. Would it have killed the writers to give us a glimpse of their first date? Even just as part of a montage in an end-of-episode number? Even Brittany and Sam as a couple are getting a huge amount of songs and development in comparison to Kurt and Adam, and Kurt was a clear main character in S2 and S3. But lately it feels like the writers barely care about Kurt and his story (or at least about it developing naturally and continuously)....

It is very frustrating that Kurt gets so short shrifted this season. In songs, in storylines, in conversations, in POV, especially in comparison with other characters who go through similar situations, like Rachel and Blaine.
It seems RIB deliberately don't want to use their best assets. Chris, Lea, Cory, Kevin, Matt, Jayma, Jane: they are wasting them. Instead we have to watch those horribly boring noobs, Bram, Blam and Blina. (I'm afraid Tina has been ruined for me)

And I suspect that Kurt is the one who gets the short end of the stick the most because he has a direct replacement they desperately want to push to become as successful as Kurt is: Blaine.
It's no coincedence that Blaine acts 'gayer' than he used to and gets the same recycled storylines that Kurt got, only without the barbs and thorns attached to them.

It makes sense if you acknowledge Blaine as Glee's new leading man with everyone and everything revolving around him. They are clearly focussing on him and his POV this season while Kurt and Rachel prepare the stage for him in NY without getting too much investment into their own storylines. Once Blaine gets there he'll have his warm nest in their loft, he will take over the Apples and turn them into a Glee-version of the Starkids, Adam, who only served as a short test of Kurt's devotion to Blaine, will be conveniently gone and Klaine reunited etc. etc. Blaine will basically get everything without having to do much for it because others paved his way. Nothing new here. Kurt's POV or glimpses of Kadam, only a minor bump in the road back to a Klaine-reconciliaton, are irrelevant in this scenario. Seeing Kurt suffering post-breakup or happily interacting with Adam would only serve to damage Blaine's image of the perfect prince charming and give rise to doubts about Klaine being the perfect match for each other.
As I am not a Klainer and want Kurt to get more individual focus again I sincerely hope this is not how the writers see their show, but considering where they chose to put their focus this season it definitely doesn't seem completely unlikely.

[valkeakuulas]

I don't know why I keep going around in circles and just not getting why I don't like these newbies and I don't understand that are there other viewers actually enjoying these chopped up episodes?

Do I live in a bubble and just do not see that I am clinging to something that they are actually planning to dump by the end of the season? Are the newbies storylines actually worth while because they've kept them now for 14 episodes, more than half of the season! Doesn't anybody at Fox listen to viewers and fans or is the show actually successful with these newbies?

I'm seriously baffled and do not get it. I'm more than anything searching for re-affirment for my astonishment: are we here in Kurt haven just wrong? Is the NY side just not cutting it? What does the general audience really want? I keep imagining this new generation of Glee watchers, post S3 viewers, who only watch the McKinley side and don't get why they have these seniors popping at their favorite school and this silly NYADA SL of two characters that don't mean anything to them. *gasp* And that idea leaves me sitting here yelling: Blasphemous! Kurt and Rachel ARE GLEE! Is there a huge Jarley fandom? Does Ryder make girls hearts ticker faster? Who likes the new Quinn Kitty?

Please prove me wrong because I'm failing fast and that 15th episode premiss gives me creeps. It's like there are all these cliffhengers for Kurtsies that are not cliffhangers at all but insults and crap thrown at us. Why the hell would I care if Blaine still has the hots for Sam whilst demanding Kurt back? Why bring charismatic actor to play Adam and then forget that now they would actually have two capable actors giving that oh-so-loved setting of a relationship. Booo, we have to imagine all that because why waste precious McKinley minutes giving us good acting.

Maybe it's again the lack of spoilers about Kurt, and Adam, that made me think about this. Maybe I should just admit to myself that the character that I loved has now been permanently pushed aside and we will not get any Kurt-centered plots this season until it's time to dig him up for the eventual Klaine revival, and even then he becomes the vessel for showing Blaine's excellence. For some reason this doesn't even anger me, but it's just frustrating because I'd like to really know if Kurtsies are wrong and don't get the big picture. How can this 70 % crap be the best that Fox has to offer? I'm sure with the money they're spending they could just transfer the NY side of the story to FX and make it a real drama about performing arts students.

This whole speculating makes me tired. But what I remember is that the lack of spoilers encouraged us at the last summer hiatus to think that they had something awesome planned for NY side, but then we got...nothing. I'd still like to think that lack of spoilers doesn't necessarily mean that there isn't a story for Kurt or Rachel or Santana but most likely it does mean Kurtsies will get zilch. And that no Kurt spoilers = no Kurt storylines, no matter how positive I'm trying to be.

And like you guys have said it's getting to me that Kurt has to date in the backround, off screen while Blaine, Sam, Rachel and even Marley (who I truthfully haven't seen much of since I refuse to watch the Lima side but that girl is teflon and plastic based on that bulimia SL and her scenes at the wedding) they get to flaunt their new relationships infront of everyone. On top of that if Santana gets a new LI and that whole process of finding someone and dating is shown it's just plain awful.

I feel like I have not said anything that I haven't complained before but right now I'm just in awe how bad all this looks for Kurt. I'm taking way too much space with my brain farts.

[ladydianab]

It would be so nice if Chris could somehow get a different series to be on. Wish thinking on my part. He is so talented that it is hard to watch him be a part of the now cast of thousands "Glee".

[Glorfindel]

I'm seriously baffled and do not get it. I'm more than anything searching for re-affirment for my astonishment: are we here in Kurt haven just wrong? Is the NY side just not cutting it? What does the general audience really want? I keep imagining this new generation of Glee watchers, post S3 viewers, who only watch the McKinley side and don't get why they have these seniors popping at their favorite school and this silly NYADA SL of two characters that don't mean anything to them. *gasp* And that idea leaves me sitting here yelling: Blasphemous! Kurt and Rachel ARE GLEE! Is there a huge Jarley fandom? Does Ryder make girls hearts ticker faster? Who likes the new Quinn Kitty?

Please prove me wrong because I'm failing fast and that 15th episode premiss gives me creeps. It's like there are all these cliffhengers for Kurtsies that are not cliffhangers at all but insults and crap thrown at us. Why the hell would I care if Blaine still has the hots for Sam whilst demanding Kurt back? Why bring charismatic actor to play Adam and then forget that now they would actually have two capable actors giving that oh-so-loved setting of a relationship. Booo, we have to imagine all that because why waste precious McKinley minutes giving us good acting.

I have 3 words for you to prove you wrong: People's Choice Awards.
Lea and Chris, and therefore Rachel and Kurt, are the most popular Glee members. Only Jane Lynch made it on the shortlist of the PCA with them, not Darren, nor any of the noobs.

RIB are morons: their egos are so big that they are ruining their own show.

[sheny]

Who’s singing and how many songs on 4x17 “Guilty Pleasures”

Who: Blaine, Brittany, Brody, Jake, Kitty, Kurt, Marley, Rachel, Sam, Santana, Tina, Wade

How many songs: 7

Bonus: 2 duets, 3 solos and 2 group numbers.

I bet Kurt will have a line or two in one of the group numbers, Blaine and Brittany will have their 100th solo for the season and maybe a duet, Jarley will sing a boring duet.

[Glorfindel]

Who’s singing and how many songs on 4x17 “Guilty Pleasures”

Who: Blaine, Brittany, Brody, Jake, Kitty, Kurt, Marley, Rachel, Sam, Santana, Tina, Wade

How many songs: 7

Bonus: 2 duets, 3 solos and 2 group numbers.

I bet Kurt will have a line or two in one of the group numbers, Blaine and Brittany will have their 100th solo for the season and maybe a duet, Jarley will sing a boring duet.

Yup.

Not getting my hopes up here. With Glee I adopt the attitude of "glass half empty" instead of "glass half full". That's better for my bloodpressure.

[Jellyrolls]

Honesty, the issue is that the old cast and the new cast just don't blend well at all. It's almost like they are writing three shows into one show--you have the NY cast, the old McKinley cast, and the new McKinley cast. Other than group numbers and choir room scenes, there is hardly any interaction between the old McKinley cast and the new McKinley cast (Brittany introducing herself to Marley in Sadie Hawkins said it all). Has Blaine had any real interaction with Marley or Jake or Ryder?

So, because they are writing three seperate casts groupings, they haven't had time to adequately developed any of them, and now of the are effective.

New York is ineffective because they don't spend enough time on it, and they haven't added enough regular characters over there to enhance the storylines there. While I enjoyed both Kate Hudson and SJP, their screentime would have been better utilized by adding an additional New York cast member. Hopefully with Santana and maybe Adam, that will change the dynamics of the NY side of things.

For as little time as they have spent on the NY side of things, Rachel and Kurt have the most character development this season.

The old McKinley cast (not the graduates) is ineffective because the storylines have failed to further develop any of the characters. Blaine has been pimped around to just about every character in the old cast, and the only development for him has been to turn him into a cheater who has bascially pined over Kurt. The interaction with Tina and Sam has done nothing for his character.

The new McKinley cast in ineffective because they keep on bringing in graduates to prop them up, and they are basically just rewrites of the old cast. They can't really gel when there is a constant stream of old character and also constant reminders of how much better the acting is on the NY side.

Fox and RIB made a huge mistake by not going with the spinoff. If I had made the decision, I would have given Chris and Lea (and maybe Naya) a 30 minute Will & Graceish Spinoff with a few new characters. I would have kept Cory on he orignal show to keep a strong actor there initially, and then slide him over to the spin off after a half year or so. I think the newbies would have had a better show of taking off if if wasn't for constant presence of the graduates.

I really think that part of the reason some parts of the fandom (like us) can't warm up to he newbies is because the NY end of things are so underdeveloped.

[fantastica]

4x17 singers

Blaine, Brittany, Brody, Jake, Kitty, Kurt, Marley, Rachel, Sam, Santana, Tina, Wade

How many songs: 7

Bonus: 2 duets, 3 solos and 2 group numbers.

from the official brazil source.

[Buenos]

Normally I would do this in snark and bark:

The problem with Glee are multifold...

but the fundamental one was that the writers/producers really didn't have a story beyond season one, which had all the inherent problems even there but it was fresh and novel enough and the cast had incredible chemistry.

Season 2 the inconsistent writing, lack of continuity, poor characterization, etc increased and couldn't be hidden and in so many ways Season 3 was really, really bad.

OF coursed didnt' realize how much the ensemble cast/actors compensated for the flaws of Glee until we hit Season 4 with the highlight of the newbies and secondary characters thrust as Leads, which leads to the perfect storm we have now with this "split narrative."

But really the poor writing started even in season one..

[ColferGirl]

Someone somewhere speculated that Kurt, Rachel, and Santana might all sing Taylor Swift's "We're Never Ever Getting Back Together" song, as a group number. I really hope that happens. (but only if we still get our Kurtana duet, it's probably too much to hope for a solo though of course I'd love that too). I hope Brody is in one of the duets, because I'd hate for a solo to be wasted on him.

But at least Kurt is singing!! And hopefully we'll get our solo in episode 18, as per tradition.

[bayth]

Such a handsome man - sigh*

[Jellyrolls]

Such a handsome man - sigh*

Why would someone want the cheater when he can have this?

[ColferInspired]

Such a handsome man - sigh*

Why would someone want the cheater when he can have this?

So true.

[Glorfindel]

Fox and RIB made a huge mistake by not going with the spinoff. If I had made the decision, I would have given Chris and Lea (and maybe Naya) a 30 minute Will & Graceish Spinoff with a few new characters. I would have kept Cory on he orignal show to keep a strong actor there initially, and then slide him over to the spin off after a half year or so. I think the newbies would have had a better show of taking off if if wasn't for constant presence of the graduates. .

Yes, I agree. This way we'd get a snarky, witty, high quality acting/singing spinoff for the core fans and more adult viewers, plus the usual shallow song and dance high school stuff in the original Glee for the teenagers who buy the iTunes songs. Everybody's happy.

Forcing the old cast to reappear briefly every now and then to prop up the newbies only makes painfully clear what we're missing out on, and that the newbies will never have that same magic the old cast had.

Normally I would do this in snark and bark:

The problem with Glee are multifold...

but the fundamental one was that the writers/producers really didn't have a story beyond season one, which had all the inherent problems even there but it was fresh and novel enough and the cast had incredible chemistry.

Initially they didn't even have a story beyond the first 13 episodes of season 1.....
Which would not have been a bad thing, if they, when Glee was renewed for 2 more seasons (!), had then sat around the table in the writers room to make a future overall plan for seasons 2 and 3, but they clearly didn't.
And that's just stupid.

[Delight]

but the fundamental one was that the writers/producers really didn't have a story beyond season one, which had all the inherent problems even there but it was fresh and novel enough and the cast had incredible chemistry.

Season 2 the inconsistent writing, lack of continuity, poor characterization, etc increased and couldn't be hidden and in so many ways Season 3 was really, really bad.

Initially they didn't even have a story beyond the first 13 episodes of season 1.....

The original idea for Glee (by Ian) was intended for a movie after all; so yes, the fresh ideas ran out fairly quickly after the initial first half season. The show had struck gold with the original cast, and it is the fans' loyalty/devotion to the cast that kept this show going way past its expiry date.

Season 2 was one big mess of relationship musical chairs, with the exception being Kurt's bullying arc; and even Kurt's bullying arc got pushed to the side to make way for a 'Kurt finally gets a boyfriend' storyline (yippee). Season 3 was, huh, well, I can't even think about it without rage boiling inside me, so I shan't. In Season 4, it's more or less back to romantic relationships again: Bram, Blina, Blam, Ryder/Marley/Jake, Marley/Jake/Kitty, Puck/Kitty, Wemma, Klaine, Finchel, Brody, Kadam. Why does the show keep on giving us relationship drama when the writers suck so badly at writing them?

Oops, getting a tad too snarky there. I'll just stop here.

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