Re: 5x01 "Love, Love, Love" Watch & Discussion thread

[AnneNeville]

Mmm....

It's possible . . . but if so, then anyone in the cast can be accused of the same, and if their screen time went down they just fell out of favor. (Not saying that it's impossible, of course. That stuff is common in the entertainment industry, I gather.)

[Lottie2303]

I like Becca. From all the Newbies she rightfully got a placement as one of the more used actors.

[brisallie]

I like Becca. From all the Newbies she rightfully got a placement as one of the more used actors.

I like her too. And I'm wondered if is because how she plays Kitty, why I started to like the character and after seen the first episode, I kinda like Kitty/Artie. I just feel like Kevin was finally paired with someone as talented as him, at least when it comes to musical terms, because though Becca doesn't the most amazing vocals, I think she has a different voice and sings quite well. As is going to happen now with their romance, I've no idea what to expect, because as Kitty said herself, Artie is about to graduate and is unsure if a long distance relationship will work- speaking of that, Blaine felt so angry when she insinuated that it might not work like other relationships in the ND. I tell you, that boy is so obsessed with Kurt and their happy ending- Anyways, at this moment I feel like Kitty/Artie are the only ones who save MK storyline for me.

Sincerely I don't know what else to say about McKenley, because everything was like a joke to me. Sue being the principal? They couldn't find another way to make her cameback without turns her into caricature? With the overdramatic background music, her argument with Figgins in the hallways was like a taken from a satire comedy. But then I remember that is been a while since I stop taking seriously Glee.

As regards NY, even though still I bear her, sometimes I hate so much that Rachel has to begs for getting things. And I hate the writers for make us believe she's someone "special", why can't she be a truly underdog? I read a comment previously that stated she will be more credible and understood by the audience if she really were able to accept that things don't get so easily in life, and rejection is part of that lesson. Anyways, still I believe she won't get the part, only because they need an storyline to work with.

Finally, Klaine. Call me unromantic, but I still disagree with the engagement, and though I've seen in real life couples who have got engaged at a young age and work out. I don't like the context of how everything happened. For me Blaine did it because he's desperate to not lose Kurt,and getting engage is a way to tie him. And though Kurt's expression was a someone who felt excited/emotional for being proposed by someone I believe he loves, also as someone mentioned in a previously post, how do you not say "yes" when you're surrounded by a bunch of people and you feel the pressure over you?. Having said that, I grant that I found the proposal beautiful, but only from an aesthetic appreciation.

I need to vent that I hate what they did with Burt, last time he talked to Blaine he said marriage isn't something easy and he said again. But also he mentioned he didn't regret for getting marriage at 22 with her wife, and it sounded to me like he was pushing Kurt to say yes. So as a way to not hate him , I said to myself his relationship was different like the one Kurt has with Blaine.

P.S Is Blaine now the officially male lead?

[Buenos]

It has to be more than a simple calculation/estimation of who's the most popular with a loyal fanbase, because Chris beats Darren in that department (too). saispa

Well the fact that Rachel went from first to 3rd or 4th in song output and 7th or 8th in screen time speaks volumes, no?   I don't think it's ever as simple as who is more popular, or even some deliberate calculated plan to downsize Rachel, Kurt and Santana.  It's a combination of :

1) McKinley being the main narrative
2) Having to try to salvage McKinley once the decision was made
3) The Noobs not taking off as stars
4) Darren being the only "star" in McKinley
5) The writers' inability to write two narratives at the same time
6) removing all the previous singing and acting  stars from the McKinley narrative
7) RM considers the revamped McKinley his pet project.
8) RIB strategy was to have 2 McKinleys, Seniors and Sophmores with no interconnecting stories.

So all this helped Blaine continue to be the "star" of McKinley because there was nobody else.   But I seriously doubt that giving Chord and Heather, for example, more episodes to sing than Lea was ever part of some master plan.

In one sense, I don't blame RIB for giving more songs to Blaine than say, Marley, Jake and Ryder.  He's benefited from the perfect storm of a vacuum on the Lima side.  Let's face it, Heather, Chord,  and Jenna were never going to wipe the floor in an acting scene with Darren.   (For Darren stans it is Nirvana that he's paired with such weak actors because they don't outshine him.   Put him in a room with Rachel, Kurt, and Santana and Blaine just implodes as the focus)  Say what you will, but he has more screen presence than they do , even if I think he has been overexposed and RIB overestimated his appeal...the legit critics make no bones in flat out stating they prefer the NY characters and don't like Lima, and the erosion of rating and itunes is the GA's response.  Yet at this point what is done is  done and  rehashing S4 isn't going to reverse the damage.

I think RM's plan was to let Blaine shine for S4 as the anchor of McKinley and then ship him off to NY by the end of the season so the Noobs would take over.  However,  It became apparent by midseason that the plan wasn't going to work because even with Finn there there was no way in hell the Noobs could carry the LIma side, plus the daunting task  having to get more replacements at the beginning of S5.  So RM thought the best of bad options was to extend the school year.    However then both Cory and Heather were gone and it made things even more glaring.

The first two episodes are interesting because (per 5.02 spoilers)  it seems most of the Noobs, sans Kitty, have been relegated to supporting background.  Marley is not really singing as the new Rachel so it begs the question if they have any intention to actually rely on the Noobs.  The obvious solution, cut off McKinley is not going to happen so I think their other options are just trying to save face and improvise along the way through season 5 and hopefully 6. The irony is that Cory's death impacted the New McKinley Directions more than it did the Original Glee characters since they were already shipped off the main narrative and in NY.

[brisallie]

Forgot to say something and is that I liked Yesterday, even though I think it was out of context, for me it was like an indirect way to remember Cory. I've no idea when Lea recorded the song, but for me she put all the sorrow she was feeling at that moment in that song.

And sincerely I broke down when they show that old Glee picture . Also I couldn't avoid to notice they cut Quinn/Dianna.

[Ranwing]

Finally, Klaine. Call me unromantic, but I still disagree with the engagement, and though I've seen in real life couples who have got engaged at a young age and work out. I don't like the context of how everything happened. For me Blaine did it because he's desperate to not lose Kurt,and getting engage is a way to tie him. And though Kurt's expression was a someone who felt excited/emotional for being proposed by someone I believe he loves, also as someone mentioned in a previously post, how do you not say "yes" when you're surrounded by a bunch of people and you feel the pressure over you?. Having said that, I grant that I found the proposal beautiful, but  only from an aesthetic appreciation.

Looking at the proposal from Kurt's POV (since the show gives us precious little of that), I can only imagine what that whole display must have looked like. To see practically everyone that he knew, who he thought of as friends were there, apparently all for him. All there to emphasize how much Blaine loved him. After all, Blaine had to love him that much to go through so much trouble to arrange everything for Kurt's benefit. Kurt is human, and insecure and it's entirely understanding why he would be so blown away by that display and feel obligated to say yes. Kurt did have his misgivings, but the fact that he loved Blaine made him want to take that chance so I don't blame him at all for being weak and yes, human.

But in the end, the display wasn't really about Kurt. It was aimed at Kurt, but the person that display really was for was Blaine. I won't try to argue for a second that the Warblers and ND and all the others were there because they had Kurt's happiness at heart. It was all about supporting Blaine and making sure that Blaine got what he wanted, which in this case was Kurt agreeing to marry him. Even Rachel, supposedly Kurt's best friend and the one who Kurt has shown so much support for over the past years, was there not for Kurt, but to help Blaine. She didn't tell Kurt what was going on, or even that she was coming to Lima. She was there to fix Blaine's bowtie for him so that when he presented himself to Kurt, he would look perfect. They weren't there to show Kurt how much he was loved, but to put on a display so spectacular that Kurt just couldn't say no to Mr. Perfection Anderson.

I'm actually a lot less angry with Burt, who at least had the honesty to give Kurt the warning about what was coming than I am with Rachel. If there is a single person besides Burt who would put Kurt's feelings first, it should be Rachel. But in the end, she sided with Blaine and helped him behind Kurt's back because to her (and the others), Kurt can't be happy without Blaine.

[Buenos]

I'm actually a lot less angry with Burt, who at least had the honesty to give Kurt the warning about what was coming than I am with Rachel.

Ranwing, I love you, but when are you not ever upset with Rachel?  

[AnneNeville]

I'm surprised about Mercedes being there to say nothing either way (and Puck wasn't there!).

[Ranwing]

I don't always hate Rachel. In fact, I don't hate her per say. I may not always like her behavior and think that she gets chances that she doesn't deserve, but I don't hate her.

This bugs me specifically because Rachel has claimed the role of Kurt's best friend and to me, that means to be as supportive of him as he is of her. Rachel knows better than anyone else just what the breakup did to Kurt and what caused the break up. It's telling to me that Rachel heard the news about Kurt and Blaine's reconciliation from Blaine and not Kurt, and who she was rushing to help.

As I said previously, there was plenty of character assassination to go around this past episode. The point that I was trying to make that the support for the proposal was not for Kurt and given all that, it's even more understandable to me why Kurt likely felt he had no choice but to say yes. If even his best friend was there supporting Blaine, how could Kurt say no?

[arina]

I think Klaine storyline (well mostly Blaine's?) was big mess in the episode but I really liked Artie and Kitty together and Rachel with Santana were very entertaining too (I really wished Kurt was part of it instead of having the terrible proposal storyline)... and I have to admit I really cried during Yesteday, I thought it was really great touching performance and the subtle hints about Finn just got me. It had to be really for Lea to film that scene.  

[Ranwing]

I really wish that they had chosen a different song for Rachel than Yesterday because we, the audience, cannot help from linking it to Cory's (and Finn's) death. I have no doubt that the song was not meant to be about Finn, but about Rachel feeling the pressure of possibly having blown her big chance and longing for the time when things were somewhat simpler and she wasn't so alone in her endeavors. Back in high school, it was a team effort that determined the fate of ND (even if she was the lead). Now, it's all on her shoulders and she's finding it a more difficult transition to make.

I also think using some of the locales in filming that sequence were problematic in telling us what the song is really supposed to be about. Sardies is the restaurant that is iconic for Broadway, but its also where Finn took her out to and where she met Patti Lapone. The bridge in Central Park was the one where she had been with Finn. Finn was clearly being recalled in a lot of that song.

[brisallie]

@Ranwing,I simply hated how everyone was there to support Blaine instead of Kurt. Ok I don't mind about Sam and Tina who currently are his sycophants, though I don't deny I didn't like how they hugged Kurt, specially Tina who I think haven't been nice to him lately. But it pissed me off more to see Mercedes and Rachel there, because they are his besties and for me they're the ones who probably Kurt was more honest about his feelings toward Blaine, so I expected they were more understanding or at least trying to be like the devil's advocate and don't be part of this. The same goes for Santana, who probably isn't his bestie, but after living for months together, I do believe she's closer to Kurt.

[Glorfindel]

I'm actually a lot less angry with Burt, who at least had the honesty to give Kurt the warning about what was coming than I am with Rachel. If there is a single person besides Burt who would put Kurt's feelings first, it should be Rachel. But in the end, she sided with Blaine and helped him behind Kurt's back because to her (and the others), Kurt can't be happy without Blaine.

Except Burt didn't. Burt lied to Kurt about "taking a shortcut on the back roads to the airport". It was Kurt who told him to stop it because he knew he was driving him to his surprise proposal.
If it had been up to Burt he would have let his son face Blaine's proposal with 50+ people completely unaware and unprepared.

[Ranwing]

Except Burt didn't. Burt lied to Kurt about "taking a shortcut on the back roads to the airport". It was Kurt who told him to stop it because he knew he was driving him to his surprise proposal.
If it had been up to Burt he would have let his son face Blaine's proposal with 50+ people completely unaware and unprepared.

*sigh* You're right about that. Lying by omission is still lying.

As I said, plenty of character assassination to go around. It would have been nice for just one person that Kurt is close to not automatically think that being engaged to Blaine is what Kurt needs to be happy.

Just deleted the ep off my DVR. Do not want to revisit it right now.

[brisallie]

Is there any character that hasn't been assassinated on Glee? At this moment I felt like the one I saw wasn't the Burt I love, who probably was kidnapped by aliens.

[Glorfindel]

^Nope, not even sweet Emma or mom Carol.  


Wow, that realisation actually only hit me after I wrote it.



Wow.

Shit writers.

[Kurt Hummel]

Kurt Hummel , you're a Klainer, and I get why you are happy right now, but honestly, there is nothing to be happy about in this SL. Blaine's speech wasn't an actual discussion, it was once again a show he put up, with nothing tangible behind it. It is a forced reunion, driven by fairytales concept of "soulmates", nothing to do with the real hardship that having a relationship with someone is. They have never even LIVED together! Nor discussed their actual future, not the one you see with rose-tainted glasses, the real one: what life do they want together? Where do they want to live? Do they want kids? How are they going to manage routine, or, if they become singers/BW stars, how are they going to handle the distance, now that Blaine proved he couldn't?  If Blaine supposedly LUUUUUVED Kurt as much as he pretended, then he would have tried to talk all this before he cheated, and he wouldn't coerce Kurt into saying "Yes" to an otherwise ridiculous proposal. He would have done it privately, he would have at least HEARD Kurt's side in all this. But no, Blaine decided that "he had lost Kurt".

I'm sick of this SL, and how people can't see that Blaine's over-the-top proposal and speech are just a cover-up of how vapid and empty his promesses are.

I see what you're saying. I feel like I should clarify (not to you specifically I promise ).I've been through some stuff these past few months and Glee is one of the only things that really makes me happy and I never felt happier after watching the Klaine scenes. I loved All You Need Is Love and Blaine's speech was amazing IMO. I know they still have a lot to discuss but they still have time. Whether it's canon or non-canon I do hope they talk about those kinds of things or at least bring them up.

Yes I felt the proposal was rushed and would of preferred it more if Kurt and Blaine were living together in New York and have been dating for while. But I'm just happy that Kurt and Blaine are back together.

[Buenos]

This bugs me specifically because Rachel has claimed the role of Kurt's best friend and to me, that means to be as supportive of him as he is of her. Rachel knows better than anyone else just what the breakup did to Kurt and what caused the break up. It's telling to me that Rachel heard the news about Kurt and Blaine's reconciliation from Blaine and not Kurt, and who she was rushing to help.

This is what I don't get. I'm not being sarcastic or anything. It's obvious that at some point Kurt stopped dating Adam because he wasn't over Blaine. It doesn't matter if Blaine hurt Kurt, if Kurt forgave him I don't see why Rachel, Mercedes or Santana should be taken over the coals because they are happy that Blaine is proposing to Kurt. Obviously they all know that Kurt is still in love with Blaine (as does Burt).

It's like when Kurt was with Adam, and Santana pointed out that he got hot and heavy with Blaine. I always thought that was the show using Santana as a Greek chorus indicating that Kurt wasn't over Blaine.

It's not as if any of them (Mercedes, Santana or Rachel) are witnesses to Blaine continuing to mistreat or cheat on Kurt.

Kurt supported both Finn and Rachel through their own whiplash courtship. He never told either Finn or Rachel "dump the loser." He supported Rachel when she was dating Brody , his exact words were "well as long as your happy" but if she would have gone back to Finn of course he would be cool with that. DESPITE how much Finn and Rachel had hurt each other.

Even when Kurt did not agree with Rachel deciding to marry Finn, nevertheless he supported her decision and even showed up for the wedding. As did Quinn who also did not approve.

So to me it's not some character assassination that Mercedes, Rachel or Santana would support it, however it is stupid they Perezberry would drop everything just to fly back home for the proposal.

[fantastica]

Yes I felt the proposal was rushed and would of preferred it more if Kurt and Blaine were living together in New York and have been dating for while. But I'm just I'm that Kurt and Blaine are back together.

everything on this show is rushed. they never take time to develop anything. that's glee's style. you can't argue w/ them. they will never change. glad you enjoy the show. i wish i could too but i am just not you.  

[ChrisColferFan1]

It was rushed. I just hope Kurt said yes because he wanted too. Not because  he felt  he had to settle  for Blaine, was afraid to be alone if he said no, or worst  in my opinion was afraid  everyone would turned against him had he said no. In my opinion he would be better off without them had that been  the case, Even his father. If that had happened I would not have any respect left for any character, except for Kurt.

[Buenos]

Yet how things have changed in just a few years.

A teenage proposal/marriage SL with two M/M kisses that bookend a season premiere (already heavily hypped/promoted in promos and media sites) doesn't cause a stir nor huge waves of outrage from certain groups anymore.

Say what you will about Glee, but it has inconsistently but steadily waged a war of attrition on this front.

[ColferInspired]

Yet how things have changed in just a few years.

A teenage proposal/marriage SL with two M/M kisses that  bookend a season premiere (already heavily hypped/promoted in promos and media sites) doesn't cause a stir nor huge waves of outrage from certain groups anymore.

Say what you will about Glee, but it has inconsistently but steadily waged a war of attrition on this front.

Just a shame they made Blaine into such a hateful character.

That RIB and Fox were and are still so intent in making Darren their number star at the price of Kurt and Chris and everyone else.

Are they just that dumb to see it isn't and will never work?

I have the episode on my desktop, but have decided not to watch it. I will someday, but not now.

I have no interest to.

This episode makes me sad from what I have been reading, in that it is like Duets when Kurt felt all alone. Only this time he is.

[Buenos]

I thought Kurt's voice was so rich and growly in "Got to Get You into My Life". That coupled with the duet next week I love that his lower register is being used more in S5.

Side note: Is it me or is Chris thinner then ever in his waist? His arms and shoulder are big but his waist seems to have shrunk even more if it's possible.  

[Lottie2303]

@buenos: The problem is, they never have shown Kurt being interested to get back together with Blaine. Even Kurt's decision to even date again came out of nowhere. So basically all we saw was Rachel and Santana supporting a proposal, they shouldn't have agreed with as their loyalties [i]should[(i] lay with Kurt. They didn't even bother to find out his opinion and we all could see he wasn't too sure about it. He really needed so totally-biased-on-his-side-guidance. There is nothing romantic at all to propose to someone after getting back together for a few days, especially at that age. If there would have been any scene with those three and Kurt talking how he misses Blaine and even wants an early marriage, it would have been a huge difference. It never happened, so I am just as pissed at those two, like Burt.

@Marie: Oh God, I never saw it from that perspective. You managed that my anger rose once again against Burt. He really lost all “father of the year brownies”. BTW, totally wrong thread, but it is bothering me since the very start. Did they change Burt’s SL at the very beginning? In S1x02 Kurt gets a car not to wear certain clothes and then it is taken away from him because of his tiara collection. Also Burt and Kurt later being so incredible close didn't even fit S1x04. I always wondered if they initially wanted to have the typical “you are not my son anymore SL” and changed it (thankfully, I prefer the endresult).

@Kurt Hummel: I think you have to understand that most of us expected an eventual reconciliation. All we wanted as Kurt fans was a good and progressive SL. They actually could have written such a great story with both characters maturing and growing as persons. Or they could have cut all ties, Blaine comes to NYC , they start talking and it leads to a epic reconciliation. The possibilities were endless to satisfy all fanbases, but once again they neglected Kurt. As someone only interested in Kurt’s side of the story, he was largely dismissed, not present at all during the SL, and all characters close to him were partly rewritten to fit the proposal. That angers us. And it should anger you too, because the proposal was bad storytelling. Klaine lost credibility to the average viewer and the rating agree with us. Nonetheless, I am happy you enjoy it and I am also happy Klaine helps you with your personal life. Believe me, we are not all heartless monster .

[Lottie2303]

I thought Kurt's voice was so rich and growly in "Got to Get You into My Life".  That coupled with the duet next week I love that his lower register is being used more in S5. 

Another moment I was so mad, as the recorded version is primary Kurt and they still managed to use for the majority Darren. Especially because Kurt sounded so great and Darren really, really needs to drink some tea and rest his voice. You can clearly hear the strain and it will destroy his vocal abilities eventually.

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