The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  tanita_mors on 8/6/2013, 9:19 am

wow, managed to remove all spoiler bars without reading anything in them. coool 

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/6/2013, 11:11 am

tanita_mors wrote:wow, managed to remove all spoiler bars without reading anything in them. coool 

How on earth did you manage that? Don't your eyes just want to wander? Wink

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  fantastica on 8/6/2013, 12:21 pm

Ivana is super human. she is the she-devil. Razz 

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/6/2013, 9:26 pm

Lottie is right, once you read the book, the separation of the twins in between the two worlds makes perfect sense. But ugh...now, there has to be at least a third other book! I want to see them reunited somehow! I adore them both and they are my favorite characters. The thought of them being separated is heartbreaking, especially when you remember how they've been together their whole lives....same schools, same grade, went through the same loss of their father, went to TLOS together twice...and now the thought of one twin returning to earth and the other not? It's sad. I wonder how they will adjust? I like the idea of the magic mirrors...so at least they have that. I always thought they balanced each other out perfectly: like yin and yang.

The idea of them growing up apart from the ages of 13 is just...sad. :(

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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/6/2013, 10:06 pm

Ezmia is interesting. Her backstory is a bit of a sob story like Evly's, but Chris doesn't make as many excuses for her. She is not a "helpless victim turned villain". She's bad, she knows it and she's proud of it. She doesn't care. It gives her a sense of power. Chris said there was more of him in her than he'd care to admit, and I can see it in the backstory. Starved for affection, resented for being talented/an overachiever, lowering standards to fit in and to be liked, even feeling revengeful and wanted people to grovel when she became powerful. I don't blame Chris for probably harboring revenge fantasies deep within his psyche...it's in every bully victim, to an extent. I believed he was only half joking with his "Never forgive, never forget" rant when Glee was still brand new. Of course, he is getting the sweetest revenge possible by becoming successful, loved and remaining a good person at his core in spite of it all...he didn't let the bullies win and make him petty, unlike Ezmia. Chris' books and films are a peek into his mind from a psychological standpoint and I love it.

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/6/2013, 10:53 pm

The chapter when Alex meets other fantasy girls is truly a cool concept. I wish we could've seen more of Dorothy. She's my favorite, and I adore Judy Garland. I'm not too into the fantasy genre, but I LOVE 'The Wizard of Oz'!

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  Lottie2303 on 8/7/2013, 5:00 am

MoviesAreLife wrote:Ezmia is interesting. Her backstory is a bit of a sob story like Evly's, but Chris doesn't make as many excuses for her. She is not a "helpless victim turned villain". She's bad, she knows it and she's proud of it. She doesn't care. It gives her a sense of power. Chris said there was more of him in her than he'd care to admit, and I can see it in the backstory. Starved for affection, resented for being talented/an overachiever, lowering standards to fit in and to be liked, even feeling revengeful and wanted people to grovel when she became powerful. I don't blame Chris for probably harboring revenge fantasies deep within his psyche...it's in every bully victim, to an extent. I believed he was only half joking with his "Never forgive, never forget" rant when Glee was still brand new. Of course, he is getting the sweetest revenge possible by becoming successful, loved and remaining a good person at his core in spite of it all...he didn't let the bullies win and make him petty, unlike Ezmia. Chris' books and films are a peek into his mind from a psychological standpoint and I love it.

I was so relieved about that, because as you know, I was so annoyed about Chris attempts to to try to justify Evly's actions. I also like and prefer villains who are just evil for the sake of being evil. Those are the most terrifying, as they don't really have any valid reasons to act they way they do, they just do it for fun and pride.

I totally believe he meant every word with "Never forgive, never forget". We live in a society where offenders constantly get excused, and victims are ignored. The victims are always supposed to take the high road, which can lead to lack of confidence and submission in life. As long as victims don't run around killing people, taking revenge and hurting others, why aren't they allowed to never forgive their bullies? Give and allow them at least some power in such a hopeless situation never had to live through for years. I never see discussions everywhere where bullies are encouraged to apologize to their victims. It is also the other way around, Drives me mad.
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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  Lottie2303 on 8/7/2013, 5:01 am

MoviesAreLife wrote:Lottie is right, once you read the book, the separation of the twins in between the two worlds makes perfect sense. But ugh...now, there has to be at least a third other book! I want to see them reunited somehow! I adore them both and they are my favorite characters. The thought of them being separated is heartbreaking, especially when you remember how they've been together their whole lives....same schools, same grade, went through the same loss of their father, went to TLOS together twice...and now the thought of one twin returning to earth and the other not? It's sad. I wonder how they will adjust? I like the idea of the magic mirrors...so at least they have that. I always thought they balanced each other out perfectly: like yin and yang.

The idea of them growing up apart from the ages of 13 is just...sad. :(

It broke my heart. Chris has to write another book, otherwise he has to deal with an angry Lottie crycry


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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 10:23 am

Lottie2303 wrote:It broke my heart. Chris has to writer another book, otherwise he has to deal with an angry Lottie crycry 

And a sad Heather! :( 

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 10:31 am

Lottie2303 wrote:I was so relieved about that, because as you know, I was so annoyed about Chris attempts to to try to justify Evly's actions. I also like and prefer villains who are just evil for the sake of being evil. Those are the most terrifying, as they don't really have any valid reasons to act they way they do, they just do it for fun and pride.

I totally believe he meant every word with "Never forgive, never forget". We live in a society where offenders constantly get excused, and victims are ignored. The victims are always supposed to take the high road, which can lead to lack of confidence and submission in life. As long as victims don't run around killing people, taking revenge and hurting others, why aren't they allowed to never forgive their bullies? Give and allow them at least some power in such a hopeless situation never had to live through for years. I never see discussions everywhere where bullies are encouraged to apologize to their victims. It is also the other way around, Drives me mad.

I wouldn't say she's evil for no reason, but she didn't have to go down that route. She's perfectly capable of "feeling" unlike Evly...she just doesn't give a crap. She relishes in being evil and in the power it brings her. She's without apology. She likes being the smaller person, if you will. Evly had more humanity than Ezmia did, but Ezmia does have her moments too...she's not like a robot. Her backstory was interesting. She started out as this talented kid with the best intentions who, kind of like Evly, had enough of being screwed over by her world...still, her and Evly are very, very different.


On one hand, I get the whole "growing up and moving on" concept. Forgiveness is supposed to be for you, not for your bully. If you held a grudge for anyone who ever did you wrong, your heart would be filled with hate and anger...what else would there be room for? It must be exhausting being angry all the time. At some point, you should say: "I'm better than this, I'm better than you" and move on from them. Don't let them effect you in this way.

But bullies get away with murder, sometimes literally. And I hate that. I like a good revenge story sometimes.

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 10:33 am

So, the chapter in which we find out Evly's fate ("The Reflection") is haunting. It's sad and beautiful at the same time. No, not "beautiful"....just....poetic justice? It's wonderfully creative and spine chilling. Also, I thought that the illustration for that chapter looked like Lea. Smile


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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  Lottie2303 on 8/7/2013, 10:35 am

Lottie2303 wrote:
MoviesAreLife wrote:Ezmia is interesting. Her backstory is a bit of a sob story like Evly's, but Chris doesn't make as many excuses for her. She is not a "helpless victim turned villain". She's bad, she knows it and she's proud of it. She doesn't care. It gives her a sense of power. Chris said there was more of him in her than he'd care to admit, and I can see it in the backstory. Starved for affection, resented for being talented/an overachiever, lowering standards to fit in and to be liked, even feeling revengeful and wanted people to grovel when she became powerful. I don't blame Chris for probably harboring revenge fantasies deep within his psyche...it's in every bully victim, to an extent. I believed he was only half joking with his "Never forgive, never forget" rant when Glee was still brand new. Of course, he is getting the sweetest revenge possible by becoming successful, loved and remaining a good person at his core in spite of it all...he didn't let the bullies win and make him petty, unlike Ezmia. Chris' books and films are a peek into his mind from a psychological standpoint and I love it.

I was so relieved about that, because as you know, I was so annoyed about Chris attempts to to try to justify Evly's actions. I also like and prefer villains who are just evil for the sake of being evil. Those are the most terrifying, as they don't really have any valid reasons to act they way they do, they just do it for fun and pride.

I totally believe he meant every word with "Never forgive, never forget". We live in a society where offenders constantly get excused, and victims are ignored. The victims are always supposed to take the high road, which can lead to lack of confidence and submission in life. As long as victims don't run around killing people, taking revenge and hurting others, why aren't they allowed to never forgive their bullies? Give and allow them at least some power in such a hopeless situation never had to live through for years. I never see discussions everywhere where bullies are encouraged to apologize to their victims. It is also the other way around, Drives me mad.

To add a bit more, Chris mentioned in an interview he can actually relate to Ezima. Heather you broke down the character beautifully as you can actually see the similarities. It is a nice way to represent how decisions can affect a life. Chris chose to continue fighting for his dreams, not being affected by his surrounding and people and eventually he succeeded big in life. Ezima tried to fit in desperately, gave up her dreams in the process, started to resent the situation and eventually despised humans/fairytale characters.

I really like Ezima as she provides a powerful and interessting villain with a lot of layers and motives without excusing her actions. She was responsible for them and no where in the book did anyone ever try to apologize for her. Thank god Sleeping Beauty didn't react the same way as Snow White. I am still not fond of Snow Whites character and she is my least favorite Queen by far.
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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 10:41 am

Lottie2303 wrote:To add a bit more, Chris mentioned in an interview he can actually relate to Ezima. Heather you broke down the character beautifully as you can actually see the similarities. It is a nice way to represent how decisions can affect a life. Chris chose to continue fighting for his dreams, not being affected by his surrounding and people and eventually he succeeded big in life. Ezima tried to fit in desperately, gave up her dreams in the process, started to resent the situation and eventually despised humans/fairytale characters.

I really like Ezima as she provides a powerful and interessting villain with a lot of layers and motives without excusing her actions. She was responsible for them and no where in the book did anyone ever try to apologize for her. Thank god Sleeping Beauty didn't react the same way as Snow White. I am still not fond of Snow Whites character and she is my least favorite Queen by far.

Thank you! Chris and Ezmia started out the same, in a way. But took very different paths. She went psycho, and he kept fighting to retain his dreams and his sense of character. He won, Ezmia lost. Now, is there a bit of Ezmia hiding out in his psyche? Yes. He's human and he's allowed to be angry. I dare anyone who is alive to tell me that they don't have the worst qualities that we all fear in humanity...we all do, but we hide them well and don't give in.

I think Snow White just tries to be very, very compassionate. It's like her main personality trait.

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  Lottie2303 on 8/7/2013, 10:45 am

MoviesAreLife wrote:I wouldn't say she's evil for no reason, but she didn't have to go down that route. She's perfectly capable of "feeling" unlike Evly...she just doesn't give a crap. She relishes in being evil and in the power it brings her. She's without apology. She likes being the smaller person, if you will. Evly had more humanity than Ezmia did, but Ezmia does have her moments too...she's not like a robot. Her backstory was interesting. She started out as this talented kid with the best intentions who, kind of like Evly, had enough of being screwed over by her world...still, her and Evly are very, very different.


On one hand, I get the whole "growing up and moving on" concept. Forgiveness is supposed to be for you, not for your bully. If you held a grudge for anyone who ever did you wrong, your heart would be filled with hate and anger...what else would there be room for? It must be exhausting being angry all the time. At some point, you should say: "I'm better than this, I'm better than you" and move on from them. Don't let them effect you in this way.

But bullies get away with murder, sometimes literally. And I hate that. I like a good revenge story sometimes.

I guess expressing myself isn't my strongest suit on the internet. I didn't see her as a robot nor as someone without feelings. I was just talking about the fact that she could commit horrendous crimes without mercy and pity. She was still a human being who resented all those who bullied her. She had history and motives but executed them willingly destroying the life of innocent bystander. I like those villains more then lets say Evly. Evly received just too much justification for my taste to like her as a villain.

No one should spend all their time resenting their HS bullies. In case people are capable happy to provide forgiveness anyway, that is all fine and dandy. But in general, I think people should be allowed to "not forgive" without spending a life hating and resenting them, as well as being judged by society. I just think we shouldn't always just preach that victims should forgive their oppressors, as I think we should spend our energy to actually fighting against and stopping bullys.

Do I make myself clear? I feel like I sound like a total asshole again, even though that actually isn't my intention fanny2 
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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  Lottie2303 on 8/7/2013, 10:50 am

MoviesAreLife wrote:I think Snow White just tries to be very, very compassionate. It's like her main personality trait.

Compassion, loyalty, sympathy and taking pity are great traits that should be celebrated and awarded much more in books, TV shows and movies. Especially because they are treated so many times as weak character traits.

But people should always be able to draw a line. Be compassionate but don't excuse the actions. So Evly had a bad upbringing?! Learn from it and fight against it, Especially as Queen when you have the means. But don't let a serial killing maniac leave just because the long lost love from her childhood is still haunting her dreams (or something alone the lines) fanny2. Because that is not compassion but sheer stupidity dryy fanny2 .
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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 10:57 am

Lottie2303 wrote:I guess expressing myself isn't my strongest suit on the internet. I didn't see her as a robot nor as someone without feelings. I was just talking about the fact that she could commit horrendous crimes without mercy and pity. She was still a human being who resented all those who bullied her. She had history and motives but executed them willingly destroying the life of innocent bystander. I like those villains more then lets say Evly. Evly received just too much justification for my taste to like her as a villain.

No one should spend all their time resenting their HS bullies. In case people are capable happy to provide forgiveness anyway, that is all fine and dandy. But in general, I think people should be allowed to "not forgive" without spending a life hating and resenting them, as well as being judged by society. I just think we shouldn't always just preach that victims should forgive their oppressors, as I think we should spend our energy to actually fighting against and stopping bullys.

Do I make myself clear? I feel like I sound like a total asshole again, even though that actually isn't my intention fanny2 

Crystal clear. I just meant that, like you said, she was still a human being and had her grievances. But she went "the bad route" and actually liked it, unlike Evly. Evly became heartless because she needed to, Ezmia became heartless because she wanted to. Evly was removed from emotion, and Ezmia still has a sense of humor.

I agree about the bullies. Not enough is being done to stop them. Usually, the victim of a crime and their abuser are not sat down together and encouraged to get along....so why should bullies and their victims be forced to do the same? School is a mini society, and this is not a good reflection of the real world. Crimes against others need to be punished. Police officers don't sit a rape victim down with their rapist and say: "So, how are you two getting along these days? Is all forgiven? Are you playing nicely now?"

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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 11:00 am

Lottie2303 wrote:Compassion, loyalty, sympathy and taking pity are great traits that should be celebrated and awarded much more in books, TV shows and movies. Especially because they are treated so many times as weak character traits.

But people should always be able to draw a line. Be compassionate but don't excuse the actions. So Evly had a bad upbringing?! Learn from it and fight against it, Especially as Queen when you have the means. But don't let a serial killing maniac leave just because the long lost love from her childhood is still haunting her dreams (or something alone the lines) fanny2. Because that is not compassion but sheer stupidity dryy fanny2 .

I agree. Snow White tries to take the good quality that is compassion and apply it to her everyday life, but she does so to a fault. Too much of anything can be bad, even if it starts out with the best intentions.

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Re: The Land of Stories 2 : The Enchantress Returns Read and Discuss thread!

Post  Lottie2303 on 8/7/2013, 11:04 am

MoviesAreLife wrote:Crystal clear. I just meant that, like you said, she was still a human being and had her grievances. But she went "the bad route" and actually liked it, unlike Evly. Evly became heartless because she needed to, Ezmia became heartless because she wanted to. Evly was removed from emotion, and Ezmia still has a sense of humor.

I agree about the bullies. Not enough is being done to stop them. Usually, the victim of a crime and their abuser are not sat down together and encouraged to get along....so why should bullies and their victims be forced to do the same? School is a mini society, and this is not a good reflection of the real world. Crimes against others need to be punished. Police officers don't sit a rape victim down with their rapist and say: "So, how are you two getting along these days? Is all forgiven? Are you playing nicely now?"

Ah, yeah we can agree to totally agree thumnup 

You just phrase is so much better then I do!
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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 11:05 am

Lottie2303 wrote:Ah, yeah we can agree to totally agree thumnup 

You just phrase is so much better then I do!

Are you kidding me? I feel like a bumbling moron compared to you!

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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 11:07 am

I love,love,love what he said about Conner and his budding writing career. So he's not the most intelligent kid, he used to be a horrible student, he's "useless" without spellcheck (I hear him): that doesn't mean he doesn't have the raw talent and the passion/drive to be a writer. I love this because I feel just like Conner.

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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 11:43 am

I loved the symbolism of the ring that Bob bought for Charlotte.wub

Trollbella is hilarious. Butterboy and Squishygirl. LOL! I love how she makes everyone dance for her.

Oh, and the twins under Red's dress as she narrates what she's doing...LMAO!


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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 6:01 pm

Does anyone else think that Conner's aversion to being referred to as a "fairy" mirrors Chris' own experiences/dislike for being called f@g as a kid growing up? :(

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Post  Lottie2303 on 8/7/2013, 6:28 pm

MoviesAreLife wrote:Does anyone else think that Conner's aversion to being referred to as a "fairy" mirrors Chris' own experiences/dislike for being called f@g as a kid growing up? :(

Nope, I saw it as a natural reaction. The way Chris describes fairy's, I don't believe any human boy would like to look like a fairy. I don't believe it has anything to do with sexuality but just simply with no interest to actually be a fairy. He is the storyteller. That is his purpose and he subconsciously knew it. Just as Alex knew to be part of the Land of Stories.
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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/7/2013, 6:33 pm

Fair enough. It's just that knowing the word "fairy" is also a homophobic slang, it made me think of his high school years. The fact that Conner didn't even want to be called that (despite the magical implications) just made me think of things. neutre 

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Post  MoviesAreLife on 8/8/2013, 7:06 pm

About villains who turn bad for no reason: I don't believe in the bad seed theory, for the most part. I think that people turn bad because of their environments, not because they were born bad. Don't get me wrong: other people don't "make" them bad, they choose that route themselves. I just don't believe people are "bad" without a cause and a reason. Ezmia and Evly are both products of their enviroments, in a way. Of course, no one made them choose to become what they are: they did it themselves. But I guess they felt they had to in order to become justified? Thoughts?

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