Carson Phillips Appreciation Thread

I haven't seen Struck By Lightning yet, (I plan of fixing that tomorrow) but from what I've heard about Carson, I feel like he needs his own appreciation thread (after all, he is wildly underappreciated) I hope that's alright with the mods, I've never really started a thread before.

So let's get to appreciating!

I, for one, adore Carson Phillips. I may be biased because he is played by Chris Colfer, but I think he's a really cool kid. A good kid, too. I would have loved to have been his friend in high school, but I'd be WAY too shy to approach him in real life because I was a typical wallflower. He strikes me as the type you would not want to piss off, but who will be in your corner if you do the same for him. I identify strongly with his need to become a success and with his passion for writing as a means for escape. The book also had me laughing out loud many times, because I LOVE that sense of humor that he has...raw, raunchy and sarcastic. It's like me (or almost anyone) without a filter.

He is no Kurt Hummel (whom I also adore because he is so kind) but he is a good kid, I think. A bit hardened because of life experiences, much like how Kurt was an ice princess (in season one and early season two) due to his past as well. It's so nice to see both of these characters come out of their protective shells. I was taken aback by the more tender moments Carson had with Malerie, his grandmother, and even his mom. I was expecting this raging jerk from what some people were saying about the character and, yes, he had his moments. But I really was not prepared for the kinder moments...I really, really enjoyed them. The scene in the journalism classroom with Malerie when the lightning metaphor was first brought up and that downright CUTE little laugh he lets slip when Malerie mimes being hit by lightning was adorable (I'm thinking that was Chris really giggling at Rebel's improv genius), the very first scene with his grandmother and the Oreos was adorable, and I thought it was a nice touch when Carson covered his mom with the blanket when he came back from that awkward dinner with his dad and April. I love how he always tells his mother he loves her when he leaves the house...it's a nice little character quirk. Well, not really a quirk....but you know what I mean. I live for those sweeter moments.

^ I agree, that the tender moments displayed by Carson are what made him... lovable. Without the tender moments, Carson would've come across as too bitter, jaded and angry. Carson is hardened by life's experiences, and uses his abrasive personality as a shield; but as Kurt Hummel had showed, you can still live in a hostile environment and come out of it a better person-- compassionate and strong where it matters.

I would add that Carson talking to that cheerleader about her dreams of becoming a ballerina is another touching moment in the movie that gives us a glimpse into the supportive friend that Carson could've become, if circumstances had been different between the two.

And since an appreciation thread about someone can't be complete without a photo of said someone, I'll post one here:

How could I forget the heart-to-heart with Claire?! You are right...that moment is also a standout and a show of humanity in what could have been an overly bitter character. I'm so glad Chris wasn't afraid to create/act out a character like this. As I said, he's no saint...but I'm also glad that he didn't go over the top and make him the ultimate villian like Sue or something. He is rough around the edges, but has a good heart. And btw, that is such a sweet picture!

Also, I really love the humour. I love how he was this funny little habit at laughing at his own jokes. It's kind of sad because no one is going to laugh with him no matter how clever he is and I think that any one of his jokes would just fly over Malerie's head. But for some reason, it just makes me laugh when people laugh at their own jokes. It's dorky and endearing.

Oh, and I loved the pillow throwing between Carson and Sheryl in the beginning! It was kind of cute in a really dysfunctional way. And that two second scene when Carson is all sore, and he waddles past his mother after coming back from Homecoming and she asks him if he's drunk. I loved when he replied, without missing a beat: "Wasted." LOL!

In light of the Glee spoilers (which I'm not too concerned with because I stopped watching Glee after season 2), I feel like we need to pay a little more attention to Chris' own prjects.

So, to start this off, I wanted to go into why I'm such a huge fan of Carson. Frankly, Carson as his own person is someone who is strong and couldn't care less about what people think about him, but what makes him cool is the fact that he fights back. I was huge fan of Kurt back in season 1, and I still am a huge fan of him, but he's become so...deflated as the series has gone on. Carson, in more ways than one, is the "anti-Kurt". He's a douche (so everytime I read reviews of Carson being a dick, I smile because that's a part of his character that I like), and he does not suffer fools well.

He does whatever he needs to to get what he wants, and sometimes I like to think about what Kurt would be like if he were more like Carson. He'd be stronger, and meaner, and frankly, for a guy in Kurt's position, you have to be mean and disliked because most people already dislike you for some stupid, so why bother trying to change their minds? Carson knows people dislike him (and while that may be from his condescending attitude or not is irrelevant) he doesn't go around trying to win people over, and he doesn't go around sacrificing something he wants for someone else's agenda. He's out for himself and, when the entire world is against you, you have to be like that if you want to survive.

That's something I love about Carson's character.

While I quite like and admire the lovely young man that Kurt as matured into, I wish that he would stand up for himself more often than he does. Kurt has got that gentle, long suffering, Lillian Gish type thing going on. The good guy. The "goody two-shoes" as Chris put it in one interveiw (I think even Chris is a little tired of it). Kurt models what we should be and how we should grow, if we were to live in a perfect world. Kurt has got a fragile type of strength and a good, strong moral center.

Carson is much more realistic. I don't confuse being mean with being strong, as I think that characters like Sue, Santana and Kitty are weak and petty if they just treat others like crap in order to get their kicks. But to those (Kurt, Carson) who are being treated like crap and who finally decide to fight back (well, Carson does)? I say, go for it. It's a sad, ugly world we live in sometimes, and you've got to roll with the punches in order to survive. Speaking as a former bullied kid, I sure as hell wish I had the guts to knock my bullies on their asses instead of just letting them walk all over me and "taking the high road".

After watching the de-clawing of Kurt into a high road-taking, long-suffering, meek doormat who lets people walk all over him, it is especially satisfying to see Chris portray Carson.

Kurt was made into a role model on Glee; whereas Chris never intended for Carson to be one. I think Chris had intended for people who watch SBL to be inspired by Carson's determination and drive; and not Carson's personality (Didn't Chris describe Carson as a jerk in one of his interviews?). I love Carson's snark though. Characters who are generally nice and nothing else are not very interesting to watch.

I wouldn't exactly call Kurt a doormat or meek. He still has traces of that snark left, only he uses it on people who truly deserve it (Sebastian and the horse teeth comment, the "I don't like you" moment) rather than using it on everyone around him like he did before (it seems he has matured since then). Actually, I would have liked to see him take a stronger stance against Sebastian, but it was still nice to see him use a little snark on him. I think Kurt is still a strong young man, it's just a different type of strength than what we see with Carson. With Kurt, it's ""I refuse to sink to your level, and I will come out the better, stronger person for it." Carson is more of the "Yeah, I can be meaner than you. You picked the wrong person to play this game with." type of character. Both have their advantages. Still, for all his "niceness", I don't think it makes Kurt boring...he's way too complex for that, whether it's because of the way he is written or the way Chris plays him. Maybe it's a bit of both. But "nice" characters can be interesting if given certain personality quirks and things to overcome. I don't think the meaner characters are automatically more interesting. In fact, characters like Sebastian just grate on my nerves.

Yes, Chris described Carson as a jerk in more than one interveiw. I think that both characters can be role models in a way: Kurt for his morals and Carson for his drive and determination, like you said.

I think this thread will turn into the Kurt Hummel Appreciation thread if we're not careful I suppose the comparisons are inevitable. Both Kurt and Carson are bullied characters, but their responses to their bullies, and how they turned out after living in their hostile environments are very different.

Yes, I agree that Kurt isn't a boring character, despite how 'nice' he became since mid-season 2. We had the benefit of watching Kurt evolve over the seasons (with Chris's delayed growth spurt and all); so regardless of how 'goody-two-shoes' the current Kurt is, we know that he's more three-dimensional than that. I used to credit the writers and Chris equally for this lovely, complex character named Kurt Hummel. Nowadays, I only credit Chris; because the writing had done great injustices on Kurt for quite a while now.

Kurt is no doormat when it came to characters like Sebastian, true. Like you, I would've liked to see Kurt face down Sebastian in a more satisfying way after all the insults and assault attempt on him (Instead of singing 3 or 4 lines in the 'Black or White' song, letting Santana confront Sebastian, or letting Rachel beat the Warblers in Regionals).

No, Kurt is portrayed as a doormat when it comes to people that the writers would never allow Kurt to fight back against-- such as Santana (Kurt would just look hurt or angry and not say anything when Santana insults him)or Blaine (Kurt would come extending the olive branch of reconciliation no matter how great Blaine's transgressions are; such as singing "I have Nothing" in response to a public humiliation and accusation about cheating). To some extent Rachel has also become this person that Kurt can't be at odds with, because of his 'best gay' status (but this may change in the future. We'll see).

That's where a lot of the frustration is coming from-- that Kurt could only grit and bear the bad things that happen to him; and lacks agency in his own story lines (since his transfer to Dalton).

The Kurt Hummel Appreciation Thread Part Two! I don't even know why/how Carson gets bullied. Personally, if I was a bully (eww), I'd be scared to pick on Carson! He bites back. He's all...brooding and moody.

I was joking with a friend during the Michael episode. I said, half jokingly: "For once, I'd like to see Kurt lose it. I want to see him knock Sebastian on his ass, and then stare down at his fist in shock." And my friend thought it would've been a super cool Kurt moment (she likes the more "bad ass" characters). I mean, Kurt's Ghandi like passive behavior is admirable to a degree...but really, Sebastian deserved to get some of those horse teeth knocked out, in my opinion. I don't like to see good people (or characters) get pushed around.

I don't know, I think Hummelberry are just so sweet and adorable together: like two peas in a pod. As for Blaine and his stance on the cheating issue: he's very two faced. Very, very two faced. Kurt handled his BS (a full blown cheating scandal) fairly well, as we saw during the latest Christmas episode. But Blaine flew off the handle over a few text messages. Also, I hate how he's being so stalker-y towards Kurt right now. Intruding on Christmas, planning to go to NYADA. Jesus. If my cheating ex was still clinging to me and was up in my business like that, I'd tell them to get lost. And I, too, hate how Santana treats her so called friends. It's a wonder she has any friends at all. She's very rude and unappreciative towards everyone. I really don't like the "frenemy" persona (part time friend, part time bully) and that, in my opinion, is not even a true friend at all. I'd love it if Kurt could snip back at her a few times, just so that she gets the message of "Hey, maybe you should treat your friends with a little more respect." Seeing as Rachel was one of her favorite targets, I'm shocked that Rachel so badly wants her approval. I don't give my bullies from the past a second thought. It's healthier that way.

I mean, hey, even Carson knows how to treat people better than that. He was never mean or snarky to Malerie, who was his one and only friend. He saved that snark for the rest of the school as a defensive tool.

Hmm... you're right in saying that Carson, by virtue of his forceful personality, shouldn't be an easy target for bullies. I think Carson receives a different kind of bullying (its nothing as straightforward as slushies in the face or getting slammed into lockers)-- where he's just generally despised, treated as an outcast and (figuratively) pushed around. However, when the blackmailing scheme was under way, I get the impression that Carson himself is behaving as a bully towards his schoolmates. Difference is, he didn't do it because he's mean. He just has a specific goal that needs to be accomplished at all costs; and being forced to write a short piece of fiction or non-fiction is hardly a terrible experience for his victims.

I'd love for Kurt to be more 'bad ass' too but the writers seemed to have written themselves into a corner when it comes to writing for Kurt. He's not allowed to do a lot of things now (such as sniping back at Santana, or telling a clingy cheating ex to get lost). Majority of the time, he can only suffer and forgive and be the better person when he is wronged by someone else (I'd add Karofsky to the list). When Sebastian appeared, we finally got a character whom Kurt can display that bad ass side of himself to; but the writers dropped the ball on that storyline.

Santana is consistently nice only towards Brittany. The Kurtana and Pezberry bonding scenes, when they did appear onscreen in season 3, feel a bit forced to me.

Yeah, Chris also hinted in the SBL book toward bullying of that sort. None physical, but plenty of emotional abuse. And I saw him as sort of a counterbully...he's not on the offensive, he's on the defensive. And you're right...he's not doing it for kicks, he's just doing it to get into college. His goal is not to hurt anyone, but to use them as stepping stones, if you will. I agree about the being forced to write....that's like punishing a kid by giving them an ice cream cone! (Well, I think so, anyway.) He forced them into one of the greatest discoveries of all: writing. Granted, he did it for himself and not them, but I can see these kids benefiting from the theraputic element of writing down the road. He sparked imagination and creativity and dreams within them again, much like how I feel Chris inspired me. I loved the added dimension that the SBL book gave to Carson in terms of his guilt for the blackmailing scheme, especially towards the two gay kids. I loved how he apologized to them and explained that it really wasn't personal, that he felt he had to do this.

I agree. I love Kurt the way he is. I don't want him to turn into a Santana/Sue/Sebastian/Kitty/Puck type (I love him because he is not like that), as it goes against his personality, but I do want to see him stand up for himself a little more. He's lovely, but it's okay to be human once in a while, too. One of the things I love most about Kurt is his tendency to stand up for others more than he does for himself. It's very touching and it shows you what a good guy he is. When he wanted to kick some ass with the Rachel egging incident, when he pushed Karofsky off of Blaine in NBK, when he took a chivalrous stance against the bullies and told them not to pick on Tina (I really love this last one because it shows that, despite his feminine traits, Kurt is more of a man than those bullies). But yes...Kurt needs to realize that he is worth protecting, too. I don't want him to become the ultimate doormat like Marley, but I don't want him to become the ultimate bitch like Kitty. There has to be a balance. RIB know that there is an interest in seeing Kurt display a more "bad ass" side (perhaps they've seen the fanfiction), if that "teaser" video for the Micheal episode that featured Chris beating up a dummy is anything to go by. That video led many to believe that Kurt would punch Sebastian in the episode. But nope.

Kurtana makes me very nervous, and I despise Faberry and Pezberry. In my opinion, Santana will always have an excuse to disrespect Rachel and that bothers me. The strange thing is is that Rachel seems to seek out this kind of abuse. She just takes it, and then extends the olive branch, much like Kurt. She needs the approval of those characters who treat her the worst, and that's really disturbing to me. That's why I love Hummelberry so much. These two are sweet and kind to each other and truly love one another. None of that "frenemy" garbage here. (This is also why I don't like Quinntana...those two are not "friends"! They seem to hate each other, and dysfunctional, petty relationships like that piss me off).

Another comparison I can make between Kurt and Carson is that they are both caretakers in a way. Kurt looks after his dad, and Carson looks after his grandma and mom. Also, the patience that he shows with Malerie is really sweet too.

Great post. I agree 100% with all of it.

Can I just say that I love the deleted scenes?! They add even more depth to Carson now! What his peers said about him at his funeral, what his grandma commented on concerning how he took the divorce of his parents...and my personal favorites: his dad being so cruel to him when the dinner with April went wrong and the scene where he has the breakdown to his grandma. The former scene adds even more of a sense of rejection that this poor kid is feeling: his mom told him at least twice that she wished she had an abortion and that he was unwanted...and now, his father told him that he was a mistake also. I loved the hurt that showed on Carson's face and that we heard in his voice. The fact that he was near tears before he walked out shows just how much his father's words affected him...he is not Kurt Hummel. Carson is not an easy crier. The fact that he was hurt almost to the point of tears is very telling.

The grandmother scene was wonderful too. Again, what a tragic character. I believe this scene would have taken place right after he yelled at his peers for the second time (the "you're all stereotypes" scene)? He feels he has no one. Claire's comment about the whole town and school actually hating him (as if he was liked before) really got to him, even if he puts on a "I don't give a shiiiiit" facade. His mom is out of her mind with drugs and alcohol, his grandma is out of her mind with dementia, and his father is out of the picture entirely. Malerie is sort of there for him, but she's so weird...so Brittany S. Peirce-like, that it's a very uneven relationship (like how Santana was mentally conscious and Brittany was just...not). No wonder he wanted to escape so badly. I LOVED how he admitted that, despite all their problems, he does love, care for and worry about his mother...and she for him, although we don't see that from her until it's too late.

Maybe that's why he works so hard in school? He grew up feeling he was never good enough, so he set out to prove everyone wrong (much like Remy)?

Also I think that he has nobody at the end,especially after he told his grandmom something that he always has been independent and don't need other people, but I think he really wanted someone to hugs him at least. Because as you pointed, his own family isn't there, because each of them has their issues to deal with. And at school, though Malerie seems to be a loyal friend, lots of times I wondered if she really understood what was happening, I'm not implying she's dumb, actually I think she's not, but she was "slow". As it were kinda difficult for her to understand things, so for me it was like an unequal relationship with Carson. As I said before, I'm sure she really appreciates him, but there were moments I felt she didn't know how to approach to him or what exactly to say.

Exactly! He even said that being 100 percent independent was a "hard thing to be sometimes" and that was putting it lightly, judging by his composure in that scene. I think he wanted to stop being so...isolated and strong for once, and wanted someone to lean on. Like I said, Malerie is the one usually leaning on Carson. Who does Carson have to really lean on? No one. He forced himself to be independent and to push everyone away not because he nessessarily wanted to, but because he felt he had to...because you don't get hurt if you don't let people in. Seeing as the people he loved (his parents) let him down so many times as a kid, he learned that you can't trust anyone.

I'm not sure if this a crazy idea and though they weren't friends, at some point I thought Vicky (the goth girl) could have been that person he could lean on. I remember there's moment she told him "Carson why do you care so much?",and I felt like besides Malerie there's was someone who was "kinda" worried for him. Although, I bet she said that because he was so upset that nobody cares for the newspaper and he has to do everything by his own.

I was thinking the same thing. Vicki seemed sort of...sympathetic to him, and he to her when he finds out she cuts herself. She also seemed the most moved during the funeral scene. Claire seemed to open up a little to him during the scene when she gives him her paper, and even Remy could indentify with the need to work oneself too hard in order to stand out. It's a shame he didn't let some of his peers in more...they and he all have more in common than he thought.

Talking about Vicky, I remember she had a pity face during the "welcoming" scene, while everybody else was laughing at Carson. But just like Carson, it seems she was someone that didn't involved in the life of other people, and if she ever demonstrated concern, is because things cross a limit.

In regards of Claire and Remy, both were girls who are pretty much worry about themselves than other people. But if I have to pick the less self-centric, I'll go for Claire.

True! Vicki and Carson are alike in the fact that they are individuals who have put up tough, protective shells and tend to push people away or intimidate them. We know what "damaged" Carson...I wonder what Vicki's story is? Only Chris truly knows...(but that won't stop the fanfic writers from coming up with their own backstories for Vicki!)

Yeah, Remy showed herself to be pretty heartless at the end with that "Plant a tree" line, which is why her deleted part in the funeral scene kind of shocked me. Which is it? Does she not care, or does she care?

Btw, is it just me, or did the publicity stills of Claire and Carson sitting at that desk in the journalism classroom make it look like she was about to jump (seduce) him?!

According to the movie, Vicky apparently comes from a religious family, so I'm wondering how much that influenced on her attitude and rebellious.

And, are you referring to the scene the director asked her for a dedicating page to Carson? Remy was a total selfish bitch there, so I also was shocked with the funeral scene. Does she has two personalities or what?. At least Claire was honest at saying she disliked Carson, but now that you're mentioning that publicity still, I thought exactly the same lol. So did she hate him or not?

It makes sense that Vicki would want to rebel against her strict upbringing...but why the self harm? I feel in order to self harm, there must be some dark issues there.

Yeah, the scene where Remy didn't even want to spare a space in the yearbook for Carson. What a bitch! I guess it makes sense that they cut the funeral scene, because her part especially was confusing...it's like, one moment she cares, the next moment she doesn't. You are right about Claire being more honest.

I'll admit, a hate-kiss between Carson and Claire would've been out of place, but hot to us Chris fans!

As for Carson and Claire...I think they hated each other, but they did seem to come to a bit of an understanding when she gives him her paper and he talks to her about pursuing her dreams.

MoviesAreLife wrote:...

I'll admit, a hate-kiss between Carson and Claire would've been out of place, but hot to us Chris fans!

...

LOL This brings to my mind when came out that scene that Claire told Carson she was going to use his truck for the welcoming. One of the comments on YT it said something like there was a sexual tension between them.

What I've read is that some people self-harm themselves as a way to calm their sorrowful, so probably Vicky went through a very hard situation. Dark issues as you pointed.

Oh, good! I'm not the only one who "sees" it!

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. I love it when authors write about dark issues...I find it very interesting.

MoviesAreLife wrote:Oh, good! I'm not the only one who "sees" it!

Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. I love it when authors write about dark issues...I find it very interesting.

I love that. Sometimes those issues comes from the depth of our hearts.

lol Silly me. Months ago when the stills came out, I thought that actually were gonna be a romance between Claire and Carson. But then I remember that Chris would never write the typical HS movie.